The new manager hunt (was the Moyes thread) only 3 days to wait...

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Comments

  • alderzalderz
    I hadn't noticed the overall loss part you mentioned so here's that too.

    Only two managers have a better loss % than Moyes (41.7% losses) in the PL - Harry (38.7%) and Slav (35.6%).

    stats 3
  • MrsGreyMrsGrey
    edited May 2018
    Wow. Thanks alderz.

    That's really useful to inform the discussion (imo) ;thumbsup

    With the caveat that Moyes has had a relatively few games in charge, so the stas are based on quite a small sample, it looks like we are hard to beat... although it may be that further analysis of losing scorelines show that when we are beaten, we are thoroughly beaten. ;weep
  • VorselaarhammerVorselaarhammer
    Why did we sack Bilic again.... ;hmm
  • alderzalderz
    MrsGrey said:

    With the caveat that Moyes has had a relatively few games in charge, so the stas are based on quite a small sample, it looks like we are hard to beat... although it may be that further analysis of losing scorelines show that when we are beaten, we are thoroughly beaten. ;weep

    "Further analysis" you say... ;hmm

    I just looked at all our losses, summed goals for and against and averaged them by manager. Again, Premier League only.

    Under Moyes, when we lose we concede an average of 3.3 goals and score an average of 0.8. No other permanent manager (post-Bonds) has a worse defensive record in defeat than Moyes does.

    That record puts him at an average goal difference per defeat of -2.50. The next worse was Avram (-2.11), and the best was (unsurprisingly) Big Sam (-1.65).

    So, basically, when we lose under Moyes we lose more heavily than in under any other of our last 9 managers.

    The flip side of that is that we actually also have our most convincing win margin under Moyes too. When we win in the league (it's only happened 6 times under him so it's not a good sample) under Moyes we score 2.50 goals per game and concede 0.33 per game, a goal difference of +2.17 per win. The next best is Avram (+2.00) and the worst was Pardew (+1.40).

    The thing to take from that, IMO, is that Avram and Moyes have won far, far less than the others so their win analysis is not robust.
  • LukerzLukerz
    alderz ;ok great stuff.

    Says a lot for our mentality under Moyes. And the general mentality of the players. First goal, as the cliche goes, appears to be vital. We don't recover after going 1-0 down, but are pretty good when going 1-0 up. Was the same under Bilic too.
  • LukerzLukerz
    Also saw a stat to say in the few games AC has started this season (think it was 7), we have won 3, drawn 3 and lost 1 (win % 43).

    He obviously makes a big impact when fit to start. And after scoring against Stoke, I think he is entitled to be miffed at his minutes in the last two games.
  • LukerzLukerz
    edited May 2018
    Speaking of which, Carroll resumes training after apologising to Moyes:
    http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11685/11355862/andy-carroll-returns-to-west-ham-training-after-apologising-to-david-moyes
  • grey_til_I_dyegrey_til_I_dye
    Nice to see that Moyes isn't letting ego get in the way of what is the best for the club.
  • baracks_a_hammerbaracks_a_hammer
    Something is getting in the way of him giving chicharito more game time and one can’t help but feel whatever it is is a spillover from the Man U days
  • grey_til_I_dyegrey_til_I_dye
    baracks

    I don't think it is personal, I think it is tactical.

    Chicarito needs a particular kind of service, and if Moyes doesn't feel we can set up to provide that for 90 minutes, then he won't play him. We probably carry a greater offensive threat when Chicarito is on the pitch, but we pay a price in terms of our defensive side.

    You can argue that Moyes is wrong about that, but I honestly don't see him allowing personality to get in the way of success.



  • Cuz1Cuz1
    I’d still put money that Chico be gone in the summer
  • alderzalderz
    grey ;ok

    Whilst I agree with that logically, my frustration is that our defence is so consistently poor that I feel it is naive to take away our attacking threat to focus on defence.
  • HammerdublinHammerdublin
    Cuz1 said:

    I’d still put money that Chico be gone in the summer

    I'd rather see Moyes be gone than Chicharito AND Carroll. These are the players a good manager can build a team around, along with Arnie, Lanzini, Masuaka and Ogbonna. Let Moyes first do his job and ensure our survival - and then I don't care if he stays or goes.
  • Cuz1Cuz1
    I’m on the unsure list didn’t want him but seemed to win me over, but recently as gone back to the unsure again, I’m leaning towards taking a punt on someone out of the usual and go from there as I stated when he arrived I thort we’d stay up but not because of him but because other teams around us were poorer, to win games you have to score goals, and fifteen minutes cameo off the bench isn’t enough for me let alone him
  • OldCastleSwiftOldCastleSwift
    edited May 2018
    https://telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/05/04/david-moyes-bemoans-west-ham-culture-leaked-stories/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

    Quite an interesting article with direct quotes from Moyes. He's (understandably) not happy with how information gets leaked at the club, which is something that I'm sure a lot of fans will agree with.

    It feels like a dig at his seniors to me. Pure speculation, but I wonder if he's already preparing his case for defence for when he gets ditched by the owners later this month and blamed for our struggles (which I think he will be) ;hmm
  • OldCastleSwiftOldCastleSwift
    "In terms of other cultural changes he feels need to be made, Moyes said: “Lots of them have been made noticeable in as much that things like recruitment. Those sorts of things are things which should be given to the head of recruitment or the manager – it should be the people who are running that part of the business.”"

    In fact, that's not very ambiguous at all, is it ;lol I think Sully has just been poked...
  • sweepy23sweepy23
    It’s a shame because I feel we’re on a bit of a merry go round. A new manager will be brought in and they’ll be saying the same things at the end of next season.
  • Slaven_Cups_His_BeardSlaven_Cups_His_Beard
    Clearly talking about Sully according to ExWHU who essentially leaks the team every week

    ;lol
  • baracks_a_hammerbaracks_a_hammer
    Ok now I’ve had time to soak in the relief and elation, back to the matters in hand

    Moyes out.
  • Slaven_Cups_His_BeardSlaven_Cups_His_Beard
    So undecided.....on one hand I think he can take us forward on the other feels like we’ve gone back 4 years
  • FortuneseekerFortuneseeker
    Relieved we have survived but I still have a real sense of being underwhelmed by all that has happened this season. I only hope we can put most, if not all, the wrongs right during the summer & if that means yet another new manager so be it. Will the owners realise what needs to be done or just fudged it as has been done over the previous transfer windows?
  • jay_in_cptjay_in_cpt
    IMO he has 2 " free hits" v Man U & Everton, let's see how those go...

    He has done what was asked, stay up, but the jury is out for me.

    It's over to you Mr Moyes, 2 wins in our last 2 games and think he will remain.
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged
    Anyone who can turn Arnie from this season's Zaza into Hammer of the Year deserves at least another season
  • FortuneseekerFortuneseeker
    If the Evertonian can think they have had enough of Big Sam who has done exactly the same as what was asked of Mr Moyes but alot better then I can see no reason why his position shouldn't be under review.
  • MrsGreyMrsGrey
    So we are modelling our decision-making on Everton? Interesting approach!
  • grey_til_I_dyegrey_til_I_dye
    Not really sure of the value of using other fans' dissatisfaction as a criteria for making decisions about our club.
  • FortuneseekerFortuneseeker
    I was waiting for that kind of response! We should be aiming higher and aspire to be competing with the likes of Everton and as you can see from the league, which is based on facts we aren't, so I see no reason why you can't use their expectations as a benchmark for ours. ;ok
  • YeoldhammerYeoldhammer
    Still not the right manager for me.
  • baracks_a_hammerbaracks_a_hammer
    ASLEFshrugged said:

    Anyone who can turn Arnie from this season's Zaza into Hammer of the Year deserves at least another season

    Don’t agree with that because it is not a person game. I don’t think he is the right person to take us forward.
  • MunichHammerMunichHammer
    I have said so before, I think he should be given a new contract. He has been firefighting so far and it is always going to be a different approach if you are in that position. However, despite fighting relegation he has managed to bring in two youngsters (Rice/Fernandes) at least one of whom has been earning decent reviews.
    The defeat at Arsenal was undeserved and with a little more luck we could be beyond the 40 point mark already.

    The only thing that bothers me is the amount of big defeats. But I honestly believe that that will get better next season.

    If he doesn't improve over the next season, fine, but he deserves a chance at the real thing.
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