The UK is Out - New PM - and whither now for Article 50
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Comments
THIS.
This is what happens when you legitimise racist views by campaigning on a 'immigration is bad' platform.
You give people who might have previously kept their odious and ignorant and hateful views behind their own front doors the belief that the majority of people feel the same, and thus they are free to express those odious views in public.
Makes me ashamed to be British.
Personally, I think he's best butting out at this point now that he's lost.
Agreed. Can't stand Cameron but he shouldn't have to negotiate something be believes is against the best interests of his country.
If he believes staying in the EU is the best thing for Britain (which I've no doubt he does believe) then he thinks he is doing the right thing for the country by not being any part of it.
Let the slimeballs Gove and Boris deal with this abject mess of their own making. It's clear now that they wanted a result other than the one they campaigned for. Their only aspirations were to topple Cameron and they've no plan for what's now been left behind.
Just about the only person who genuinely wanted what's happened is Nigel Farage. Just let that sink in.
;run
;biggrin
Bad child.
Nobody has a lower opinion of Cameron than me, and I still think he's done the right thing by resigning. The Leave campaign are banging on now about respective democracy. Well, Cameron has a democratic right to resign his position as leader of the party.
I think the Leave campaign's real anger at Cameron lies in the fact that they now know those who were apparently the bastions of their campaign have turned out to be malignant sacks of deceitful pus, and nobody wants to step forward and take responsibility for what's happened. It must be worrying for all those voters who wanted Out to see the heads of the campaign suddenly go so quiet. Perhaps they had another agenda?
And bottled it because he didn't like the answer.
He really didn't though, did he? He never promised to stay on whatever the result as far as I can remember.
He asked the public whether they wanted to stay in the EU. It was pretty clear to practically everybody that he would resign should the answer be negative, so I'm very bemused why anybody is surprised.
The referendum was a very big opinion poll. Nothing within its question or its result deals with who or how it should be enacted.
The Tory Party had the offer of a referendum as part of their manifesto.
The Tory party was elected to govern.
The question on the ballot paper was
Should the UK Remain or Leave the EU.
The Govt ran the referendum.
The govt can do what it wants with the results.
We vote in an election for a party to form the govt, we don't vote for its leader.
We aren't the USA where we vote for the leader - the party itself elects its leader. The party itself is responsibly for delivering (or not) the outcome of this ballot.
Cameron tells Parliament he's going to trigger Article 50, because he made a promise and the people want him to..
They say, no you aren't, and vote against it.
Tory Party have a vote of no confidence.
He's sacked.
He's not PM any more.
He can't trigger anything.
But that's OK because it was only Dave's idea and promise?
As IronHerb says above a good point.
But to help unify the country moving forwards I do believe the Brexit negotiation team should feature people from Remain and be cross-party.
BUT the Brexit campaign was NOT based on Immigration is bad - that is what the Remain campaign accused it of saying. What was being said is that uncontrolled immigration is bad and the EU Immigration rules are actually discriminatory against non-Europeans, like our close relations in Australia, New Zealand and Canada.
Corbyn. Now personally I don't particularly like the guy, but what has he done to
offend so many people since the vote.
An EU referendum result I (which I assume many) did not expect, which is fine if you wanted it but many didn't and some wish they hadn't voted for.
Cameron not fulfilling what he said he would i.e. remain Prime Minister no matter what.
Boris actually realising he may have to go through with what he said he would do, but now understands that it is more complicated than he had contemplated, presuming he does actually want out of Europe.
Corbyn in a position of no confidence and sacking anyone who doesn't agree with him, yet believes he can still lead a revolution.
Farage loving the fact he has got what he wanted, despite not being an MP but probably wondering if what he expects to happen, will actually happen, .
Everyone wondering what the Monday morning stock markets will look like.
I do wish the result had been different but I guess we need to get on with it.
Thank goodness we still have West Ham, Bilic and Payet (for now anyway).
Gove
;doh
But that's how many perceived it, lacking your subtlety.
The whole 'cut immigration' line - which of course predates the referendum - has for a long time been peddled by UKIP (an organisation which openly allied themselves with an avowedly and openly racist MEP so secure their EU funding); it has been part of the Daily Mail's discriminatory racist agenda for years. It is the long-established aim of openly racist groups and individuals. And covert ones too.
So I am not surprised that the 'officialisation' of a view which seems to support an anti-immigrant position opens the door to more overt and explicit attacks on immigrants. And against people who are not immigrants but have brown skin.
I maintain that the referendum has legitimised (for some people) the expression of racist views. And for that, I hold the Brexit campaigners mainly responsible, for not distinguishing clearly enough, and for taking advantage of the existing groundswell of hate without sufficient concern for the consequences.
I doubt very much that the UK will be able to negotiate such favourable terms as it currently enjoys.
End result:
same rules and laws at a worse rate.
Excellent effort all round...
But realistically, who has the strongest negotiating position?
The UK isn't self-sufficient in food.
We need to buy food from somewhere else.
So who will be in a position to negotiate the most favourable terms?
Thorn, the terms of a new deal being less favourable is my supposition, yes; it's why I chose Remain.
The requirement to accept EU rules and laws to be part of the 'common market' is a fact.
Now if the Leavers become PM and don't want to trigger it, they're the one bottling it.
When he did bottle it was when he called a referendum with no real run-up because he wanted to stop his backbenchers defecting.
That this increase in racism has come is no surprise to me. It was enough of a reason to vote no, though that apparently made me a London elite.
Dodger, it's true there were plenty of attempts to put a better face on the immigration line but I don't find any of them honest. Did EU immigration policy stop the UK giving long-term visas to people from the commonwealth? And there were few attempts to counter some of the outright hatred - like Farage's 1930s style poster.
Hard to tell how EU will react regarding trade terms. There's a possibility they'll punish the UK to stop other countries following.