Transfer Deadline Day: It's weird because it's October

Cuz1

ianbishoplegend said:

What we are lacking right now is a flair player - a spark. Behrama is exactly that

If there was a disagree button I’d press it so many times but respect your opinion

OutcastLondoner

Mark Noble is Mr Fallover, when he realised he’s too slow and needs to buy a free kick. They might be fouls but he buys them and there’s no one better at it than him. Zaha isn’t much different to most players and gets fouled a lot more than them.

baracks_a_hammer

I don’t think we have necessarily lacked flair players of late. Ones who work hard and put in a proper shift though? Where does Benrahma stand on that front? There are already a few questions being raised on his work ethic and he hasn’t even joined. His talent alone won’t make him a success in the Prem.

ianbishoplegend

He will be hungry to prove himself in the Prem. I think he will be a big upgrade over Lanzini and Yarma fighting for Bowen’s place

jay_in_cpt

Can’t see it happening anyway..
IMO there is little to backup he’s an improvement on what we have, unproven at best.
Other areas need more attention IMO

OldCastleSwift

According to Ex we bid for King, Bournemouth rejected it, so we turned our attention to Benrahma. What kind of strategy is that? Do we want a striker? Or a winger? It's all over the place.

Lukerz

King plays as a LW

The club have identified wide forwards but probably wanted King given his proven PL record.

OldCastleSwift

Lukerz said:

King plays as a LW

The club have identified wide forwards but probably wanted King given his proven PL record.

Thought we had plenty of wingers.

Ex has now said that we may still go back in for King, even if we get Benrahma, so obviously we don't.

OldCastleSwift

Sounds like Benrahma is getting closer.

Also looks like Dawson will be done early next week. 4th choice CB, by all accounts, for around £2m.

So Moyes wanted a starting CB in July but has to settle for a back up player who is probably no better than Alese or Baptiste. But hey, he's cheap and a Salthouse client, so you know...

Thing is, it's not Dawson's fault. He shouldn't get the stick he's getting without even kicking a ball for us. Just so frustrating that we spent most of the window chasing defenders that were never going to come, and now we're settling for a player that most fans predicted we'd end up with that doesn't actually improve our defence, and a big money attacking midfielder. It's almost as if it was deliberate 🤔

OldCastleSwift

C&H saying we've agreed a fee for Benrahma but still some details to be sorted. King is apparently back up if this deal doesn't get agreed.

However, Moyes prefers King, which would be the easier deal (we'd just need to offer Bournemouth more money).

Surely if Moyes wants King then that's the deal to do. He's the manager. Back him.

ianbishoplegend

I bet Benrahma is better on fifa and young Jack prefers him

baracks_a_hammer

King is one of those that can be strung along till the last moments of this window. I don’t think anyone else in the Prem is going to bid beyond what we have in that time. Therein lay a problem for Bournemouth. Because by the time Jan comes (under 3 months) he may become unsellable as he may just sign a pre-contract with another club and he may well have a lot more options then.

Personally if we have bid £13m for him, is he really worth a lot more than that given his contract position?

Trouble is we are terrible at negotiating. Levy would have probably had him for about £8m if Spurs had wanted him

OutcastLondoner

My one thing with King is I’m not sure how good he has been recently. I remember him being on fire for a period but no much of him over the last season or two.

OldCastleSwift

That's a fair point Outcast, and I'd have to agree, but ultimately it's about what the manager wants, surely. If we get Benrahma just because Sullivan wants him, then what's the point of having Moyes? May as well put Sullivan in a tracksuit and have him in the dug out.

Jorderz_Moyes_will_be_Moyes

I find it highly unlikely the club is spending this kind of money on a player Moyes hasn’t asked them to buy.

Lukerz

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

OldCastleSwift

Lukerz said:

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

Sorry Lukerz, not for me. If we couldn't get Tarkowski or Fofana, then we should have gone all out for the next on the list. If not him, then the next. If the manager wanted a top class centre back, then that's what he should get. No way is Craig Dawson that player.

Yes, signing good players is a good philosophy, but in our situation we can't afford to buy that many good players. We let go of a good attacker to buy a good defender in line with the manager's wishes, but have now decided we need a good attacker, who actually costs more than the good attacker we let go. I'm really struggling to see the logic.

Lukerz

There may not have been a next though. You won’t just have an extensive list of options of quality CB’s.

We had a couple, we could not get them, we moved on.

Cuz1

ianbishoplegend said:

I bet Benrahma is better on fifa and young Jack prefers him

ianbishoplegend said:

I bet Benrahma is better on fifa and young Jack prefers him

Tho you think he’s worth the punter

OldCastleSwift

Lukerz said:

There may not have been a next though. You won’t just have an extensive list of options of quality CB’s.

We had a couple, we could not get them, we moved on.

We bid for about 30 centre backs. Sullivan wasn't prepared to go the extra mile for Tarkowsky, didn't think Milenkovic was worth the money, would only take Tah on loan, managed to talk Car out of a move.

The players were there, but Sullivan didn't want to do the deals. I don't think there was any intention of getting a top class centre back. I honestly think Dawson was always going to happen because of Salthouse, and I suspect Benrahma was always a target, because of Salthouse.

OutcastLondoner

Lukerz said:

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

Isn’t it the philosophy that has seen us by Hernandez, Haller, Fornals and Anderson and struggle to use them (especially the first two)?

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

OutcastLondoner said:

Lukerz said:

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

Isn’t it the philosophy that has seen us by Hernandez, Haller, Fornals and Anderson and struggle to use them (especially the first two)?

I think the difference is the signings are being green lit by Moyes

He likely would get a new CB with the bulk of our budget, but the players available likely aren't good enough to justify that type of expenditure

And while Benrahma may not necessarily be needed, weren't we saying that Anderson needed replacing? And is this not an exciting replacement ?

ianbishoplegend

Moyes did mention that defenses these days aren’t as good as before. Maybe he changed tack and going all out attack

Fortuneseeker

As OCS said we were reported to have made several bids & if we had wanted to buy a top class centre half we would have found a way but we didn't which is pretty alarming and what we have come to expect from the way GSB believe they can do deals with very little success.

OldCastleSwift

ianbishoplegend said:

Moyes did mention that defenses these days aren’t as good as before. Maybe he changed tack and going all out attack

That was pretty much Slav's philosophy. Fine when your attack is firing (remember when Payet, Lanzini and Sakho were on top form? Yikes, that was good), but when it fails your defence is exposed. Got him the sack in the end. I don't think Moyes would put himself in that position.

Lukerz

The Athletic reporting that a £30m fee (including add ons) has been agreed for Said Benrahma. He will undergo a medical on Wednesday after returning from International duty.

OldCastleSwift

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years said:

OutcastLondoner said:

Lukerz said:

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

Isn’t it the philosophy that has seen us by Hernandez, Haller, Fornals and Anderson and struggle to use them (especially the first two)?

I think the difference is the signings are being green lit by Moyes

He likely would get a new CB with the bulk of our budget, but the players available likely aren't good enough to justify that type of expenditure

And while Benrahma may not necessarily be needed, weren't we saying that Anderson needed replacing? And is this not an exciting replacement ?

He's a good player, but is he better than Diangana? And if so, is he £12m better than Diangana?

If rumours are true that Dawson is costing us £2m and Benrahma £30m, wouldn't it have been better to keep Diangana and spend the extra £14m we seem to have found on a better centre back than Dawson?

If Dawson was one of Moyes’s preferences, why didn't we do the deal earlier than the domestic window?

The only person that I can see benefiting from our transfer business this window is Salthouse; he was involved in the Diangana transfer, involved in the Benrahma deal and has Dawson on his books.

ianbishoplegend

OldCastleSwift said:

ianbishoplegend said:

Moyes did mention that defenses these days aren’t as good as before. Maybe he changed tack and going all out attack

That was pretty much Slav's philosophy. Fine when your attack is firing (remember when Payet, Lanzini and Sakho were on top form? Yikes, that was good), but when it fails your defence is exposed. Got him the sack in the end. I don't think Moyes would put himself in that position.

In the end Slav had Ayew, Snodgrass, Noble and Hernandez trying to figure out how to move up the pitch

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

OldCastleSwift said:

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years said:

OutcastLondoner said:

Lukerz said:

I don’t mind that decision. It was clear that the money was gonna go on Tarkowski or Forfana. In the end, we could not get either, so we have switched & bought a cheap CB & now spent that money on a player in another area of the pitch.

Getting good players is a good philosophy, regardless of position.

Isn’t it the philosophy that has seen us by Hernandez, Haller, Fornals and Anderson and struggle to use them (especially the first two)?

I think the difference is the signings are being green lit by Moyes

He likely would get a new CB with the bulk of our budget, but the players available likely aren't good enough to justify that type of expenditure

And while Benrahma may not necessarily be needed, weren't we saying that Anderson needed replacing? And is this not an exciting replacement ?

He's a good player, but is he better than Diangana? And if so, is he £12m better than Diangana?

If rumours are true that Dawson is costing us £2m and Benrahma £30m, wouldn't it have been better to keep Diangana and spend the extra £14m we seem to have found on a better centre back than Dawson?

If Dawson was one of Moyes’s preferences, why didn't we do the deal earlier than the domestic window?

The only person that I can see benefiting from our transfer business this window is Salthouse; he was involved in the Diangana transfer, involved in the Benrahma deal and has Dawson on his books.

I don't know if he is or isn't

All I know is that he had a superior season to Diangana, arguably was THE standout player in the league last year, plus he's had 2 standout years compared to Gradys 1

Do I think we should've swapped them?personally no as I liked Grady and liked seeing a natural winger in how he hugs the touchline...but from what I've heard Benrahma seems the superior talent, and think with Masuaku offering the width down the left, he and Diangana would end up occupying the same spaces a lot, whereas Benrahma will drift inside so is probably a better fit for this formation

But at the time when Grady was sold, didn't seem their was any interest in Anderson, Yarmolenko, Lanzini etc. I don't think we'd be after him if Anderson was still here

In terms of using the money to get a better CB, I agree but you have to trust in Moyes. Yes it was obviously a huge area of concern hence why we made it a priority, but maybe Moyes has seen that we have kept 2 clean sheets back to back against two very good teams and doesnt want to splash the cash on a centre back unless he knows that he will be a huge upgrade (who knows if Rodon is good enough for the Prem)

I think Dawson was always on the radar, but wasn't high up the list. Moyes said he wanted experienced defenders, and Dawson is that and he's coming in as 5th choice

buffybegood

alderz said:

Remember the last two times we changed owners and how optimistic we all were?

Not sure many of us were thrilled when G&S bought us, especially with how popular they were at Birmingham beforehand. I seem to remember it was more a "lesser of 2 evils" vibe at best.