The 'couldn't think where else to put this' and decided it didn't merit a new thread thread
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Comments
If the clubs want to support the Royal British Legion (or indeed any of the other charities who do the same work) they can. At any time.
If they want to join or hold Remembrance Day Commemorations, they should be on Remembrance Sunday or (where it isn't the same) 11 November.
Having commemorations at 'convenient-for-us other times when we can fit them in with all the other stuff we've got going on' - which is what is having a ceremony on 28th October actually is - devalues the significance for me, and makes it all about the club.
I can't see any need for clubs to do anything other than in the game which occurs on Remembrance Sunday weekend, if they choose to.
If no games fall that weekend, why mark it at all?
It has nothing to do with football.
By all means, observe the minute's silence at 11.11 in the workplace.
Do people who aren't going to be at work on the 11th at 11:11 observe it the last time they are at work before that date?
There's 10 home games the week after, which is a lot nearer than 3 week before.
Apparently we are seeing Jeremy Hardy tonight ;wahoo.
It is part of my birthday present.
#happyhappy
;wahoo ;champagne
The loss of life , unbelievable scale
Yes, that is what Remembrance Sunday is for.
Not sure it has to be expanded outside that.
There was no choice, he had to go......
How many times must it take place before it becomes a tradition? ;hmm
Also from the OED a generation is ''generally considered to be about thirty years''.
Wearing a poppy is a tradition, poppies on football shirts is a recent Daily Mail inspired piece of nationalistic emotional blackmail
I had a quick google, but all I could find were a couple of places where police cuts have meant that the police won't be providing security this year. So it is a possibility that unless the local organisers can sort out their own security/marshalls, the ceremony will have to be changed. In particular, the idea of closing the roads to have a procession through the town might not happen.
They could still have a wreath-laying ceremony at the war memorial. ;hmm
Poppies on shirts had nothing to do with my post and so your reference to the DM is therefore irrelevant.
I must be living in some kind of bubble as I can't see where this "nationalist emotional blackmail" is nor any "bigotry". I suppose it comes down to what significance the Remembrance commemorations has to the individual. All the junior clubs locally have had their kick off times altered so every club can pay their respects. ;ok
The Remembrance Day ceremonies is one thing (of which poppies have always been a part, since it was adopted at the symbol of remembrance initially of those 'on our side' who died on the Western Front in WW1, but later in WW1 as a whole).
The other is the individual wearing of the poppy symbol. This is what (I thought) Aslef was referring to.
The latter came about because the Royal British Legion's November fundraising campaign gave you ... if you put some money in a collection box ... a little poppy 'badge' to pin to your lapel to show you had donated to that particular charity. Like getting a daffodil if you chuck a few coins in the Marie Curie street collection.
I agree with Aslef that now, the wearing of a poppy has become almost mandatory (in the court of popular public opinion) unless you want to be judged anti-patriotic.
Just look at the whole furore over James McClean.
I won't wear one - it has become symbolic of something much bigger and wider than 'remembrance'. And I don't buy into that or want to be associated with it.
I mean, if someone isn't wearing a daffodil pin in March (when Marie Curie Great Daffodil Appeal takes place)... what conclusions might we draw about that person?
Now substitute poppy for daffodil and March for November ....
I certainly do not judge anyone who is not wearing one, there are many reasons why someone may not be wearing one, not least of which may be that it may have simply fallen off, and just because I have given support to a charity, I may justifiably choose not to wear a badge symbolizing to the world that I have done so.
However - I do believe that the poppy is an appropriate and instantly recognizable symbol of rememberence and it remains extremely meaningful to those for whom rememberence is personally important.
I do wish they had not gone to the extent of putting the poppy on every football shirt- however, I think it reasonable that each team should host a brief ceremony and a minutes silence at an appropriate time closest to the established rememberence weekend.
It is about paying respect and it really is appropriate, at least in my opinion, that the current and future generations, remember the sacrifice of those who went before us.
Once again in my opinion, War is mostly avoidable and will always be regrettable, however, I find it hard to come to any other conclusion than the rising up of the free world to overcome facism and imperialism in WW2 was one war where the sacrifice was great, but totally just, and we have a duty to remember them.
;poppy
I think that's the problem.
The poppy is a powerful symbol, but its symbolism has developed several levels.
Imagine what would happen if one of the Sky pundits in the studio was seen not to be wearing a poppy when all the others were. (Or, as MrsG said, see how much grief James McClean gets each year.) In a perfect world, it would be nothing. It's a free country, a free choice, and no one should have to adopt a symbol if they choose not to, and there should be no social consequences.
But I'm pretty sure there would be outrage among certain sections of the community, and that, for me, is wrong.
For example...
A huge fuss about whether or not Corbyn would wear a red poppy at his 1st Rememrance day service as Leader of the Opposition - pressure was put on him by the PLP etc. Quote from article below 'The wearing of the red poppy is the ultimate celebration of Britishness.' That is not an uncommon opinion. (Edit - NOT ;doh )
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11947452/Does-Jeremy-Corbyn-have-any-idea-what-Poppy-Day-is-about.html
ITV newsreader lambasted for not wearing one while reading the news http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2505791/Charlene-White-ITV-news-suffered-racist-abuse-wearing-Remembrance-Day-poppy.html
Comments besides the racism include things like 'you aren't fit to sit in front of the British people'.
When Siena Miller didn't wear one on the Graham Norton Show... cue outrage and insults, widely covered in the press. 'Even former Conservative defence minister Sir Gerald Howarth waded in, telling the Sun there should “be no excuse for not wearing one so we can honour the war dead.”'
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/sienna-miller-criticised-for-not-wearing-a-poppy-on-graham-norton-show-a6717036.html
Comments like 'shame on her' and 'she shouldn't be allowed on the show'.
Surely the fact that people are free to make the decision as to whether they wear the poppy or not is one of the important examples of why we remember in the first place.