West Ham recruitment and general grumbling

OldCastleSwift

alderz said:

OldCastleSwift said:

Bottom line is, as good a season as it's been, we won fewer games than last season, lost more, scored fewer, conceded more, got fewer points and finished lower in the table.

So whilst we had the extra Europa games to contend with, we actually regressed in every aspect.

Important we do what we can to not let that happen again next season.

I don’t think that is the bottom line, for me at least. You can’t look at the league in isolation, otherwise I could say “our Europa League performance was immeasurably better than last season so we’ve improved”. You take the season as a whole.

I think the bottom line is that we dropped one place from last season - despite playing 56 games this season compared to 44 the year before - and we qualified for Europe again.

But the numbers don't lie. Statistically we've performed worse than last season in all of the key areas.

And the extra games weren't a surprise to anyone. We knew there'd be extra games and less recovery time between games, but we didn't increase depth of the squad, nor did we utilise the U23s enough, IMO.

I know not everyone will agree, but that's how I see it.

Slacker

OCS, have you enjoyed the ride this season?

EXETERHAMMER

Another very good season for us. Just one win away from 6th which would have been outstanding. That said we have to reflect on the lack of squad depth. Our first 11 are a match for anybody, but you cant expect them to perform week in, week out.
I hope, want, expect us to bring in at least 5 or 6 players who would challenge our first 11.
Striker
AM
CM
CB
LB
Plus utility defender

PrestonHammer

Can the non grumblers leave us grumblers to grumble please? Hahaha

Hamstew

Lol yeah tbh I thought this thread was a safe please to come and have a moan and/or an over reaction. A bit like one of those rage rooms.

Lukerz

You risk starting to sound like a Spurs fan…

Lukerz

The squad depth is a bit of a red herring as it assumes that signing more players means that we improve, which often is not the case. Leicester fell to mid table when they reached the 1/4 finals of the Champions League.

We’ve done well, overall, but could have done better.

Fortuneseeker

EXETER, You missed out a new Goalkeeper, otherwise I agree. IF we get a LCB who can also play LB it reduces the number needed down by one.

Slacker

L

Fortuneseeker said:

I really enjoy contributing on this forum so I am not going to start digging people out. Just to say I still haven't seen any evidence that we did make a real effort to bring in the players we needed especially in the last window, if not in the previous one either.

Have you seen any evidence that we didn’t?

PrestonHammer

We don't want common sense talk in here either! Hahaha

Fortuneseeker

Slacker, Action speaks louder than words, in the same way no one has been able to prove conclusively that we did. If we had failed in one window then ok, but we have come up short a lot recently.

OldCastleSwift

MrsGrey said:

I don't know how anyone can look at this season and say we regressed in every aspect. I really don't.

But in terms of league table standings, we literally have. Fewer games won. More games lost. Fewer points. Fewer goals scored. More goals conceded. Lower league position. Weaker European competition qualified for. It's literally a worse league season than last time.

Performance, fight, spirit etc. are all subjective, but in terms of cold, hard league table facts we've regressed compared to last season.

whupathman

MrsGrey said:

I looked into my crystal ' what happened in the alternative universe ' ball. In fact, we signed a brilliant striker and a CB in the January window. They both got injured and missed the rest of the season.

the we all would have said how unlucky we were but we have some good signings for next year and strengthened the depth of the squad and have fewer needs in the off season.

Slacker

OldCastleSwift said:

MrsGrey said:

I don't know how anyone can look at this season and say we regressed in every aspect. I really don't.

But in terms of league table standings, we literally have. Fewer games won. More games lost. Fewer points. Fewer goals scored. More goals conceded. Lower league position. Weaker European competition qualified for. It's literally a worse league season than last time.

Performance, fight, spirit etc. are all subjective, but in terms of cold, hard league table facts we've regressed compared to last season.

I still don’t get what you mean, have you enjoyed this season or not?
We have progressed so far and had some great days and nights , why not just enjoy it?
I just don’t get the negative vibe tbh.

MrsGrey

OldCastleSwift said:

MrsGrey said:

I don't know how anyone can look at this season and say we regressed in every aspect. I really don't.

But in terms of league table standings, we literally have. Fewer games won. More games lost. Fewer points. Fewer goals scored. More goals conceded. Lower league position. Weaker European competition qualified for. It's literally a worse league season than last time.

Performance, fight, spirit etc. are all subjective, but in terms of cold, hard league table facts we've regressed compared to last season.

You are just selecting the facts that prove your point. There are other facts ( criteria) that would show an improvement on last season but you are ignoring those.

PrestonHammer

Show us them then.

Yeoldhammer

With Burnley relegated we now have the oldest squad in the league, and are about to lose a bunch of players to an already small squad and expect to compete in multiple fronts again, unless we bring in half a squads worth of players we will be back to praying for no injuries.

I have 0 faith in the owners to do what's necessary and Moyes will be left woefully short unless Newman has done what he is paid to do and find some decent buys for a small outlay.

We also have the added bonus of 5 subs being allowed from next season so a core squad of 13 / 14 is not going to cut it.

OldCastleSwift

MrsGrey said:

OldCastleSwift said:

MrsGrey said:

I don't know how anyone can look at this season and say we regressed in every aspect. I really don't.

But in terms of league table standings, we literally have. Fewer games won. More games lost. Fewer points. Fewer goals scored. More goals conceded. Lower league position. Weaker European competition qualified for. It's literally a worse league season than last time.

Performance, fight, spirit etc. are all subjective, but in terms of cold, hard league table facts we've regressed compared to last season.

You are just selecting the facts that prove your point. There are other facts ( criteria) that would show an improvement on last season but you are ignoring those.

Like what?

In a direct comparison to last season, in terms of W D L F A GD Pts, we're worse off in each one.

With regards to the in-game stats; possession, shots on target, conversion rate etc. then yes, we may have improved, but in terms of what all of that results in, i.e. points and league position (which is ultimately what the clubs and fans care about), we have regressed.

Not a criticism. Not a call for Moyes’s head. Just an observation.

Lukerz

Yeoldhammer said:

With Burnley relegated we now have the oldest squad in the league, and are about to lose a bunch of players to an already small squad and expect to compete in multiple fronts again, unless we bring in half a squads worth of players we will be back to praying for no injuries.

I have 0 faith in the owners to do what's necessary and Moyes will be left woefully short unless Newman has done what he is paid to do and find some decent buys for a small outlay.

We also have the added bonus of 5 subs being allowed from next season so a core squad of 13 / 14 is not going to cut it.

I don’t get how you can have no faith in the owners when over the last 2 years they have provided the funds for the following players: Bowen, Soucek, Coufal, Zouma, Lingard (wages), Vlasic whilst keeping all our best players. These players have given us 6th & 7th placed finishes. There have been opportunities to criticise the funding in the past, but not the last two seasons (IMO).

alderz

OldCastleSwift said:

MrsGrey said:

OldCastleSwift said:

MrsGrey said:

I don't know how anyone can look at this season and say we regressed in every aspect. I really don't.

But in terms of league table standings, we literally have. Fewer games won. More games lost. Fewer points. Fewer goals scored. More goals conceded. Lower league position. Weaker European competition qualified for. It's literally a worse league season than last time.

Performance, fight, spirit etc. are all subjective, but in terms of cold, hard league table facts we've regressed compared to last season.

You are just selecting the facts that prove your point. There are other facts ( criteria) that would show an improvement on last season but you are ignoring those.

Like what?

In a direct comparison to last season, in terms of W D L F A GD Pts, we're worse off in each one.

With regards to the in-game stats; possession, shots on target, conversion rate etc. then yes, we may have improved, but in terms of what all of that results in, i.e. points and league position (which is ultimately what the clubs and fans care about), we have regressed.

Not a criticism. Not a call for Moyes’s head. Just an observation.

But it’s not a direct comparison between seasons. You can’t directly compare a league season in which we played 12 fewer games to this one, without taking into consideration all the other reasons.

It’s like comparing an F1 lap where someone had a flat tire to one where they don’t. Obviously that’s a drastic example, but you have to recognise that we played far more games, and had much success in those, btw, and that affected our overall performance.

If you can’t look at mitigating factors and wider context then plucking stats doesn’t really mean anything, IMO.

Yeoldhammer

Lukerz said:

Yeoldhammer said:

With Burnley relegated we now have the oldest squad in the league, and are about to lose a bunch of players to an already small squad and expect to compete in multiple fronts again, unless we bring in half a squads worth of players we will be back to praying for no injuries.

I have 0 faith in the owners to do what's necessary and Moyes will be left woefully short unless Newman has done what he is paid to do and find some decent buys for a small outlay.

We also have the added bonus of 5 subs being allowed from next season so a core squad of 13 / 14 is not going to cut it.

I don’t get how you can have no faith in the owners when over the last 2 years they have provided the funds for the following players: Bowen, Soucek, Coufal, Zouma, Lingard (wages), Vlasic whilst keeping all our best players. These players have given us 6th & 7th placed finishes. There have been opportunities to criticise the funding in the past, but not the last two seasons (IMO).

if that's all you can put out for 4 windows worth with a loan to boot i don't consider that a strong case for the owners. Considering the manager got us into Europe last season.

IronHerb

So when we do well, last season sixth place, people say "but Spurs, Arsenal and Wolves were under par" and when the following season we come seventh, and Arsenal and Spurs take up their 'rightful' positions, then we have regressed.

Not having it. Two great back to back seasons imo, and there is room for improvement. So looking forward to a third great season next year.

COYI

MrsGrey

PrestonHammer said:

Show us them then.

If I thought rational argument would convince anyone on a basically emotional thread, I would do the research. But be honest, I'd be wasting my time! You know it's true 😂

Pearces_Left_Foot

20/21 Season PL 6th EFL 4th Round FA Cup 5th Round
21/22 Season PL 7th EFL 1/4 Final FA Cup 5th Round Europa League Semi Final

So we dropped 1 place in the league got further in the league cup and got to semi in europe and same in FA Cup. Overall we probably won more games overall this season to last due to European run and going further in the league cup.

Pearces_Left_Foot

Football 365 take on our season

West Ham
The steam understandably expired by the end and shifting priorities meant that West Ham last recorded consecutive Premier League wins in January. Their stunning European exploits inevitably exposed a shallow squad, an issue which David Moyes seemed strangely reticent to ease by resting players at certain points. But ultimately, even dropping a place in the table, the Hammers exceeded expectations by keeping the pace in the league and reaching a fifth round, quarter-final and semi-final. For the first time in their history the club qualified for European competition through league position in consecutive campaigns. The standards have not been allowed to slip.

PrestonHammer

PrestonHammer said:

We don't want common sense talk in here either! Hahaha

This also applies to you Mrs Grey! Hahaha