West Ham v Man City, Saturday 24th October, 12.30

Brother_Sledge

Live on BT Sport

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

Same again

Only question I think is do we opt for Balbuena or Diop as the right sided CB

Think Balbuena had a shocking start of the game, and was the main culprit for our poor start but actually thought he settled quite well and had some very good long passes

But wouldn't surprise me if Moyes opted for Diop who is also a bit rash

Lanzini obviously scored THAT goal and looked sharp but it would surprise me if he started over Fornals

Would be good to get Benrahma and Haller on the bench

alderz

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years said:

Think Balbuena had a shocking start of the game, and was the main culprit for our poor start but actually thought he settled quite well and had some very good long passes.

He did settle in, but I do think that Spurs took their foot off the gas at 3-0, which helped him a lot. When Son was running at him he looked all at sea, and made some really poor decisions. Swap Son out for Sterling, and I would be worried. That's not to say that Diop would be any better.

I personally wouldn't change the side, and if we have everyone fit the bench is pretty decent: Randolph; Diop Fredericks; Noble Lanzini; Benrahma Haller

We've got a really good squad these days. The worry is (obviously) the massive lack of depth at LWB, CM and ST, but I'll leave that for another thread...

thornburyiron

I don’t think Spurs did take their foot off the gas. I think we started to get a bit more aggressive and determined. We could have had a couple in the first half and Kane was here there and everywhere even blocking a certain goal from Coufal.

Lukerz

Same team.

Obvs Antonio seems to have a tight hamstring. That will need to be managed & maybe rest him for the next two games in all honesty. Last thing we need is that tearing. 3 months with Haller...

Haller also has a knock. Potentially this could be Benrahma making his debut as a more central player.

Hopefully we keep the score respectable. The biggest issue when we play them at home is we lose heavily (0-5, 0-4, 1-4, 0-4, 0-5 - last four home games).

BubblesNeverDies

What cost us early was the high defensive line we were playing, which meant we were very susceptible to the long ball over the top of our (slower) defenders.
Their first goal was a classic example with Son outpacing Balbuena.
I don't know how fast Sterling is but I expect Moyes will take into account the inherent risk of the high line and avoid a repeat.

OutcastLondoner

I don't see them having anyone do the Kane job, so we won't be outnumbered 4 v 2 in midfield again. We might against Liverpool with Firmino though. Kane's been doing this, playing those passes into Son for a while now. We shouldn't really have been caught out so badly by it.

I think Diop has more pace to cover against Sterling, so might be one for him. Anyway, he's the perfect example of a player who we can and need to elevate through coaching, because if he improves his judgement, then we have a great CB.

ianbishoplegend

The game I look forward to least of the season. I never enjoyed the Barcelona style much even less so the suffocating Man City style. Anyone with some pace and quick recovery needs to be playing right side of defense. I would put Coufal right centre back with Fredericks RWB.

MIAHammer

I'm not totally convinced about Diop. When he is running back facing our goal he never seems to be able to sort his feet out in time, if the ball comes to him. A lot of times he doesn't clear the ball but ends up given it back to the opposition.

OutcastLondoner

Yeah, fair concerns MIA. I just think to have been one of our mainstays and still be only 23 is impressive. He's got a lot right but he hasn't progressed much since arriving. He could do with good coaching, in my opinion.

ASLEFshrugged

ianbishoplegend said:

The game I look forward to least of the season. I never enjoyed the Barcelona style much even less so the suffocating Man City style. Anyone with some pace and quick recovery needs to be playing right side of defense. I would put Coufal right centre back with Fredericks RWB.

Has Coufal ever played CB? Or is this assuming that if Cresswell can play CB then every FB must be capable of doing so?

ianbishoplegend

He knows how to defend and is right footed. That’s all you need for that position right now!

alderz

ASLEFshrugged said:

ianbishoplegend said:

The game I look forward to least of the season. I never enjoyed the Barcelona style much even less so the suffocating Man City style. Anyone with some pace and quick recovery needs to be playing right side of defense. I would put Coufal right centre back with Fredericks RWB.

Has Coufal ever played CB? Or is this assuming that if Cresswell can play CB then every FB must be capable of doing so?

It was the second thing

claretandbluesky

On their day City are the best side in the league in my view but we are at that stage when you feel we can get something from any match and so we have at least a chance this weekend. We will have to be sharp from the first whistle however as City will be hard to breakdown should they get the first goal. We will need try and shut them out and look for the odd counter or set piece to try and snatch something.

ianbishoplegend

alderz said:

ASLEFshrugged said:

ianbishoplegend said:

The game I look forward to least of the season. I never enjoyed the Barcelona style much even less so the suffocating Man City style. Anyone with some pace and quick recovery needs to be playing right side of defense. I would put Coufal right centre back with Fredericks RWB.

Has Coufal ever played CB? Or is this assuming that if Cresswell can play CB then every FB must be capable of doing so?

Not sure why you are so married to the idea that a player can only play one position. Many of the worlds greatest have changed positions in their careers. Gareth Bale nearly scored against us from the right wing. He was formally a left-back. Moving from Right back to RCB is hardly asking him to play in goal.

ASLEFshrugged

Some players start their careers playing in one position and end up being successful in another, that doesn't mean that ALL players can play in different positions and be good at it. Geoff Hurst was a winger who Greenwood turned into a world class centre forward but I wouldn't want to see Antonio at RB again unless we were really desperate.

I just cannot see the sense in asking a player who has been with the club just three weeks and who has been excellent in his natural role to play in a position he's not played in before against a team that scored the most goals in the Premier League three seasons in a row.

I could understand it if all our CBs were injured but we've got four CBs and two others who have played at CB available.

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

I think the issue here is that most teams/players are used to some variation of a back 4, and I think a back 5 is a hybrid systems in that a winger could play at wing back and a full back could play as a CB.....so just because a player hasn't ever played in that position, it may be just because they've never had an opportunity to

Remember under Conte, Chelsea had Azpiliqueta (a player whos always been a full back) as a CB where he was fantastic and Moses (a natural winger) at RWB and they won the league

Cresswell has also been a player transformed as LB playing in a back 3 and Walker looks good there for England

I wouldn't be opposed to the idea that Coufal can play the RCB role, but I do think that if you have 4 of the back 5 full backs then you can find other issues

Id stick with Coufal RWB and then one of Diop or Balbuena as the 3rd CB (is Cresswell our #2 CB?)

alderz

I just think it’s risky to play a back three with two fullbacks in it. One I think makes sense because Cresswell can push on and add another body to the attack with two people left to cover. Two players in the back three who are used to pushing into space runs a massive risk of leaving huge spaces for the best midfielder in the world to exploit.

And I’m not wedded to the idea that a player can only play one position. I’m just not convinced that every player should be changing position.

Lukerz

I think it could work against City, as Balbuena’s game is not going to be suited to City. There is going to be no big hold up man for him to mark & they play a very fluid system where players move all over the place. More agile, versatile defenders, who are quick & good on the ball, would be better suited & not sure it’s the worst idea in the world. Rice can always drop in if necessary to help out & make it a back six. We are going to need to sit really deep in this game to avoid any chance of a battering. I don’t expect him to make those changes to the back line, though.

ASLEFshrugged

Leicester beat City 5-2 playing pretty much the same formation as us, defending deep and playing narrow to stop City playing through the middle. Both City's goals came from corners.

We got caught out playing a high line on Sunday, hopefully we won't repeat the same mistake on Saturday.

ScotHammer

Didn’t a lot of people criticise Moyes for playing square pegs in round holes? Playing Coufal at CB would be this.

That said, this game could be viewed as a “free hit”, so we might want to try something new.

In my view we should stick with a similar “winning” formation, as this would boost the belief in the team for future more winnable games where we have lacked consistency/faith in the past.

OutcastLondoner

We need at least two CBs with an aerial presence, so it has to be Balbuena or Diop.

thornburyiron

Aslef Hurst was a left half when Greenwood moved him up front because he felt he’d never get game time with Moore in that position. It could have been a disaster but was a worldie success.

ASLEFshrugged

thornburyiron said:

Aslef Hurst was a left half when Greenwood moved him up front because he felt he’d never get game time with Moore in that position. It could have been a disaster but was a worldie success.

Indeed, Hurst was a half back. I don't know about Coronavirus but I'm pretty sure I'm getting a touch of the Alzheimer's

Cuz1

For me this game his more about the performance the pride the attitude to the game than the winning I can live with the better team winning but not the above

Yeoldhammer

Be nice if we didn't get pummeled at home again.

2019/2020 West Ham United 0 - 5 Manchester City
2018/2019 West Ham United 0 - 4 Manchester City
2017/2018 West Ham United 1 - 4 Manchester City

Expat_Hammer

2020/2021 West Ham United 2 - 1 Manchester City

You heard it here first

MIAHammer

Pep will have watched the Spurs goals and will have a plan. Do we have a plan B to counteract that plan.

Cuz1

We don’t have a plan A lol 😂 😂😂

ianbishoplegend

ASLEFshrugged said:

Some players start their careers playing in one position and end up being successful in another, that doesn't mean that ALL players can play in different positions and be good at it. Geoff Hurst was a winger who Greenwood turned into a world class centre forward but I wouldn't want to see Antonio at RB again unless we were really desperate.

I just cannot see the sense in asking a player who has been with the club just three weeks and who has been excellent in his natural role to play in a position he's not played in before against a team that scored the most goals in the Premier League three seasons in a row.

I could understand it if all our CBs were injured but we've got four CBs and two others who have played at CB available.

Do you think it’s not natural for Coufal to move 10 feet infield from his right back position? Personally I would give him the benefit of the doubt in that one. I wouldn’t want to try it against Andy Carrol, but against Sterling and Aguero it makes more than enough sense to me.

OutcastLondoner

It’s not just a matter of moving a few feet. A centre back and a right back have different sets of skills, they’re used to operating in different spaces. Would you move Tarik Lamptey into RCB as well? Wingers can often become full backs but rarely become centre backs. Centrebacks and holding midfielders sometimes exchange positions but you don’t see them move into wider positions as often. I think part of the reason you can often have one full back playing in a back 3 is that, if needed, it can basically become a back four in possession with one of the wing backs dropping back. You can’t do that with two full backs in the back 3.