Burnley (Away) 14th October 3pm (match thread)
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Comments
We have some idiotic players and you cannot blame Bilic for their actions .
It just seems that we are our own worst enemy and sendings off like Carroll’s and Arnautovic’s are just pure stupidity and mean we will continue to struggle.
AC's 1st yellow was 50/50 IMO ..
The 2nd fair enough, while AC was naive to say the least, I think the ref could have warned him , but saying that the 2nd yellow was worse than the 1st....
AC let us down but I can't remember so many 50/50 decisions going against us for ages, a rookie ref with a poor
Performance overall , he nearly lost total control of the game IMO
Any case we won't get Mr Atwell again for a while and now AC can pay for his foolishness ....
Pity we couldn't hang on but all considering a point will have to do..
My take on the incident is that the first was a touch harsh and had they come the other way around he would not have got sent off for the first were it the second one. However with them being the way around they were the ref had no choice. I like Andy Carroll but that was brainless, to have just been booked and yet the very next challenge you launch yourself from afar leading with your elbow defies belief, Arto's against soton was cynical but Carroll's just stupid.
The team however played very well with 10 men and defended well until the goal, for which I feel Fonte had a duty to jump even if not likely to reach as he would have mis sighted anyone behind him, as it was he allowed their player to get his eye in and attack the ball sighted.
In all we are looking better than many teams this season so I don't feel we will be in a scrap come March but it will be a grind and a waste of a season, something it really shouldn't have been. In my view we should have had a point at Soton and three here so would have added three points to our total which would have us on 11 and in 9th as of writing.
As for individual players I feel Reid is our most essential at present and Antonio not far behind, as long as they stay fit we will pick up points.
Oh hang on...
;deadhorse
He was giving back what Tarkowski had laid on moments before. Unfortunately, Marko Arnautovic had his own brush with the officials too and cards were on Attwell's mind. Attwell's performance, upsetting everybody, is the sort which comes with police escorts on the continent.
Carroll's second foul, however, was reprehensible. The action, with eyes fixed on Mee, coupled with the proximity made it completely brainless. Inexcusable, Bilic thought.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4980316/Burnley-1-1-West-Ham.html#ixzz4vVlTCVPs
steve One game I think.
Thought the ref was poor. Inconsistent throughout, missed stuff, let things go, poor positioning, got the players wound up... Not sure if we benefitted overall or not. Bit of a shambles.
Don't think the 2nd was a red for AC. It was a yellow, fair enough, but we've all seen lots of games where refs have held back a deserved 2nd as it would mean sending the player off.
I've no problem if they all stop doing that, but you know that won't happen.
I agree AC didn't help himself, but Atwell was inconsistent and weak throughout the game, imo.
I think a lot of refs would have let themselves have a bit of a think, pulled the captain, and put AC on final notice.
As I said, if they never did it, fair enough, but when you don't know who will, and when, or why, it makes it a bit of a mockery/lottery.
I agree with grey to a degree, most officials like to keep the game 11v11 and for me that should always be the aim when refereeing games. Only when you have no choice do you pull out the red or second yellow. I don't think yesterday was a 'no choice' moment.
However, AC was incredibly naive given his experience. Had a 20 year old done it I maybe would've had some sympathy. But AC knows the game, knows the little things teams do to gain an advantage. He needed to cool off. Going around, given his frame, like a Bull to a red flag so soon is always going to put him at risk. I felt the ref had the chance to have a word. Bring Reid over, AC and the Burnley captain, have a word, calm him down, the game carries on.
But the ref was not wrong in issuing a second yellow because it was a very heavy and clumsy challenge. Just a shame he didn't think about it for 5 seconds longer.
What disappointed me more than anything is, after weeks of campaigning against diving and cheating in general, Dyche seemed to have a side out there who certainly didn't emulate his words. The way they pressured the ref almost before Andy made contact into sending him off was pretty embarrassing.
I thought was justified myself, then goes and do exactly the same, just a minute
later. How stupid can you be to do that. ;doh
We fully deserved the 3 points here. Even with 10 men we created the better chances. Really good decision to sub off the ineffective Arnie for Pedro who had a monster 45 minutes.
Strange to sub off Hernandez when Antonio, who had a good game, ran out of steam after 60 minutes. I don't think he is fully fit as this isn't the first time this season he's run out of puff.
We did ride our luck with the Hart pen, which was easier to call on slow mo than real time, and when the ball came back off the post and hit Hart.
Lots more positives than negatives to take out of this game. COYI
Without sounding like a grumpy old man, believe me a) this is WHUFC, it's what we do b) I'm grateful to be seeing WHUFC in any season, no matter how it goes
;ok
(Goes for a lie down)
;biggrin
;ok
Kouyate could've seen yellow very early on, he applied some common sense and didn't book him, the AC challenges left him with little to no choice imo, that was an Arnie moment for me from Andy and he deserves to be taken to one side and told by Slav he's let the lads down then get his cheque book out and write one for 160k
Also that was a nailed on penalty Hart gave away, I've seen people say he pulled his hands out, so? He hit him with his body, we also got lucky with the post.
Key moment, when 1-0 up if that falls to Chico and not Antonio we win the game imo
For me, we got lucky that it wasn't a straight red. I agree the first yellow was harsh as he was jumping from a stationary position but the 2nd was as clear as you get get. Running start, then launches himself with arms flailing.
Incidentally, on NBC they showed in slow-mo that Hart pulled his arms away and actually got the ball with his elbow. More luck than judgement but they all agreed the referee got it right.
Atwell possibly got those decisions correct although a harsh 1st yellow for me, however his overall performance was definetly below par for me ;ok
Not sure the first was even 50/50.
If Carrol was entitled to challenge for the ball (and imo he was) then I don't see what he did wrong, or what else he could have done.