Liverpool v West Ham , Saturday 31st October , 5.30

BubblesNeverDies

ASLEF:
After Liverpool we've got Fulham, if we're going to rest Antonio it should be against them as they are clearly out of their depth.

Kiss of death

thornburyiron

After Fulham we’ve got the Blades, neither have won yet this season.

Cuz1

That’s Fulham and the blades first win out of the way then 😂🤣

buffybegood

Although I'd obviously love to get a result against them, if there's any doubt at all about Antonio (and I think there has to be), then I feel it's not the worst game for him to sit out. I know that we're in good form and there's a chance we could nick a result, the likelihood is that, even with Antonio, we'll come away with nothing.

What would be unforgivable would be to start Antonio, he gets injured and we lose anyway, and then we lose him for half a dozen matches where we really should get points but end up unperforming because we've no like-for-like replacement for him.

So I'm with Lukerz, quite happy to see Antonio sit this one out. It's a long season with the lack of depth we have; far better to sit one game out than suffer an injury that will mean he misses many more.

ScotHammer

Totally agree. “Better to lose the battle, and win the war”, and other more suitable sayings!

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

If Antonio does indeed miss this i am curious to see what Moyes does

I just can't see us setting up with Haller in that role, he just is too static

We could play Bowen off him, more of a 352 but Bowen will have to track Robertson, who is arguably been Liverpools vest player behind Salah

Perhaps Benrahma there

Or we mix it up and change tactic, which would be a shame as its really suiting us atm

Jorderz_Moyes_will_be_Moyes

I think we have to play Haller. He doesn't do what Antonio does but he will trouble Liverpool's makeshift defence and he can finish if chances come.

MIAHammer

Let’s keep it simple. Play Haller and tell our wingers to cross the ball into the box. Without VVD they’ll be vulnerable.

Yeoldhammer

Rumours Antonio out for up to 2 months.

Lukerz

Yeoldhammer said:

Rumours Antonio out for up to 2 months.

That would be devastating news but not exactly unpredictable...

Would be typical that we rack up a good points tally in the hardest opening 7 games going, then lose Antonio for two months when all the more winnable games arrive.

Easy to be wise after the event, but a bit of a shame we played him against City after he showed signs of this against Spurs.

Where have you see that, Yeold?

Lukerz

The good news would be, between the Man City match (24th) & the 22nd November, we only have two matches; Liverpool & Fulham.

So that is a month to play with more or less without any damage done.

Whitehorsehammer

Yeold, I heard a rumour that he was going to be alright for the Liverpool game, the trouble with so many rumours is that it is often just a lazy journalist setting hares running. Time will tell.

ASLEFshrugged

On the plus side Antonio wasn't limping when he came off so it could be the same as when he came off against Spurs. If he is fit I'm putting a tenner on him not finishing the 90 minutes on Saturday.

Maybe that should be alongside Magic Minute, predict the minute Antonio gets subbed.

Me and my mates used to have something similar for John Moncur; how long after he comes on before he gets booked.

Lukerz

If Antonio is out...

Fabianski
Balbuena - Ogbonna - Cresswell
Coufal - Soucek - Rice - Masuaku
Bowen - Fornals
Haller

Randolph, Diop, Fredericks, Noble, Lanzini, Yarmolenko, Benrahma

Moyes decided not to sign another striker so it is down to him now to get the best out of Haller with his game plan. He should benefit from Coufal & Masuaku getting forward & slinging crosses in but Bowen & Fornals need to get up in support of him as often as possible.

steve

Have to play Haller,Give him a couple of games of 90 mins ,We do have more about us and with Bowen and Benrahma more chance of getting some kind of service to him ,And Cressie seems to have figured out how to cross a ball again

baracks_a_hammer

This will be a significant test now for moyes. He needs to demonstrate that we are not a materially different proposition (in terms of effectiveness) as a result of just one player not being there. If it were 3 or 4, then yes maybe but not just one.

OutcastLondoner

I don’t see why in this system the wingers can’t push closer to him while attacking, knowing they have cover from the wing backs. Haller I think will disturb the team the least. I don’t think of Yarmolenko as someone who carries the ball very far, so don’t think he compares to Antonio. He works space to shoot but doesn’t really run behind defenders that much. I think he’d disrupt how the others play. Bowen would offer something of what Antonio does but it’s not the same and we’d lose him on the wing. We lose most of Antonio’s on the ball work with Haller but i think he’ll still hold it up and still make the right runs. Coufal puts the same cross in and it’s only Haller I’d back to score from the non-Antonio options.

claretandbluesky

It's hard graft but if we are attacking down one side the other winger has to get straight in close to Haller and act as the second attacker he needs around him. Bowen can finish and is fast so should be able be effective in the box.

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

The problem isn't getting the balls into the box

The problem is getting up the pitch to put ourselves in a position to get the crosses in

Haller needs to be sharp, we will be under pressure we won't be able to drop it right at his feet, he will have to anticipate it, hold it up untill Bowen/Fornals (or Benrahma) get up in support

alderz

But this is where we need to adapt the approach play. At the moment our tactic is kind of "kick it into that big open space and get Michail to sprint into it". We need to be playing into Haller rather than into space, and then have the wingers getting narrow and running off of him. IMO, Benrahma and Bowen are the better two to have on the flanks. They have pace, they are forwards, rather than midfielders, and they are potentially pretty lethal.

Look at how Liverpool and Spurs play at the moment, with the central striker dropping off and letting the wingers make those runs. It's definitely doable, it just needs a slightly different approach.

ianbishoplegend

For Haller to work Fornals has to go unfortunately. We cant go back to lacking Pace again. Haller should be good enough at 45m to fit into any system and be effective though. He really needs to step up a level

Lukerz

Fabianski
Coufal - Balbuena - Ogbonna - Masuaku
Soucek - Rice
Bowen - Fornals - Benrahma
Haller

Is another option, but resorts to going back to a back four.

EXETERHAMMER

I think that could work Lukerz, but Bowen and Benrahma will need to be disciplined getting back.

buffybegood

Lukerz said:

Is another option, but resorts to going back to a back four.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

BubblesNeverDies

The thing that worries me is how often Citeh were able to play those balls through the middle to their runners. It was as much their poor ball control as our defending that kept them from scoring.

Ravel49

Lanzini has a good record against the ‘pool

#false9

alderz

For me, the line up is as it was last week, but Benrahma and Haller in for Fornals and Antonio. Fornals has been playing well, but he also looked pretty dead the other day by the end. I feel like if we want any kind of threat on the counter we need more pace, and we need people getting close to Haller.

The rest of the players can just stay back and defend as far as I’m concerned. Bowen, Haller and Benrahma all can stand on the halfway line so we have someone to clear it to.

ASLEFshrugged

If Bowen's first few games is any guide then Benrahma will be on the bench for the next couple of games.

Bowen had been playing regularly for Hull before we signed him, Benrahma has only played three times for Brentford since August, the last time being 22 minutes on 4th October. He managed 90 minutes in a friendly 9th October then came on in the 89th minute four days later.

If he's not fit then giving him his first start against Liverpool seems a bit ambitious

buffybegood

Harsh to drop Fornals imo, and I don't think Moyes will. Benrahma a decent option off the bench though, especially against tired legs.

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

Fabinho apparantly off with a hamstring injury tonight in their Champions league game

Another CB down