Covid19: Support and Chat

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  • KuchinghammerKuchinghammer
    Thorn: yes, it was too late: people were carriers for a week, and Boris ignored the Chinese & Korean examples. So a spike in positive tests, and therefore a spike in the death rate some time later, happened.
    I can't say if lockdown will work fully. Sensible social distancing may be as effective. But the UK did nothing for a week, which was the worst choice.
    The number of volunteers makes me think the majority of Brits are fully on board with fighting the virus. I won't comment on what to do with the idiots, although making them work with the NHS staff may be a useful way to use their infallibility.
    Once the numbers tail off, the restrictions can be gradually eased, but I don't see that happening in April. Just my opinion, not a dig at anyone.
  • thornburyironthornburyiron
    Kuching China kept the whole thing secret for over a month because they knew they’d created a killer. By the time they decided on a lockdown they’d already spread it to other parts of the world so I wouldn't hold them up as a shining example.
  • IronHerbIronHerb
    It certainly won't end in April. The current measures are purely aimed at reducing the spike to a level below the number of intensive care beds available to the NHS and then slowly reducing. The intensive care beds will be pretty full for a few months yet but hopefully at a level that can be managed.
  • IronHerbIronHerb
    Just an aside but I for one have been mightily impressed by Dr Jenny Harries, the Deputy Chief Medical Officer, in the daily briefings. Gives clear information, never flustered and gives a totally calm impression. :clap:
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged
    Last week the National Farmers Union said that they'd need 70k (who will get paid £400pw) to work on farms, if not then a lot of UK crops are going to rot in the fields and unless we can import food there could be shortages.

    Some people have compared the current situation to the war but perhaps they should remember that after 1945 rationing actually got worse.
  • BubblesNeverDiesBubblesNeverDies
    Worth a read:
    https://intpolicydigest.org/2020/02/24/china-s-influence-in-multilateral-organizations-and-covid-19/
  • KuchinghammerKuchinghammer
    Hello Thorn, this is a bit late because of the 7 hour time difference. I don't think anyone can say China is morally a shining example of anything, from environmental issues to working conditions to freedom of information. I used China and Korea as good examples of how to deal with the virus.
    It took until mid-January to discover what covid-19 was, and then the Chinese New Year migration of 100+million people back to their ancestral lands was beginning. The government immediately imposed a travel ban, isolated Wuhan, and contained the spread by early March.
    Korea did much the same.
    From the end of January, all European countries had evidence that covid-19 had spread to them. This is when they should have followed the Chinese & European examples. They did very little, even when the WHO finally announced it was a Pandemic.
    Britain was slowest to act, or acted on the morally dubious principle that 'herd immunisation' was the answer: let 70% become infected and let the weakest die.
    When the death rate spiked, the government woke up and we have the present situation.
    My point was that this could have been avoided or at least minimised, and we may have been returning to normal in three months (like China says it is doing) from early February - so football etc in early May.
    Sorry this was so long, but it's a complex issue.
  • BubblesNeverDiesBubblesNeverDies
    Kuching, not sure about Britain being slowest to act.

    https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-why-hasnt-sweden-gone-into-lockdown-over-covid-19-pandemic-11966132
  • KuchinghammerKuchinghammer
    True, but I did say earlier that Social Distancing may be effective. Personally, I think Sweden will have to change that policy. Are Belarus and Russia part of Europe? Have they acted yet?
    So I'll amend that to Britain acted slower than Italy, France, Spain etc etc. Or even "too slowly" to avoid a Geography lesson ;)
    btw I came across a Larsson cartoon that is topical for the USA situation...


  • thornburyironthornburyiron
    Kuching I’m not sure Italy acted that quickly. They spent the first weeks just checking people who entered the country from China and overlooking the fact the the north of the country had borders which were allowing people in and they hadn’t appreciated the fact that the virus was already in the country.
    I know they’ve been in lockdown for about a month now but I saw earlier this week that people are beginning to question whether they still need to be in that situation and are getting stir crazy. Lockdowns/isolation in democracies are more difficult to manage without using more stringent penalties.
    In countries such as China it’s easy, stay inside or risk getting shot.
  • grey_til_I_dyegrey_til_I_dye
    Lockdowns/isolation in democracies are more difficult to manage without using more stringent penalties.
    Only because of the inherent selfishness of a section of the community. if people know that adhering to 'stay at home' will increase the chances of people surviving Covid by reducing the pressure on the NHS, and choose to ignore it, because it is bothersome, then there isn't much to celebrate about that democracy, is there?
  • thornburyironthornburyiron
    Whenever there is free will you will always get idiots or selfish morons who choose to ignore common sense however much you may want to shoot them I don’t think that’s an option although I sometimes think the odd example being set wouldn’t go amiss.
    As far as the Chinese having this totally under control the WHO are querying whether the figures being provided by them are real and have suggested investigating after this is over.
    Similarly Russia and North Korea are claiming that they’ve either had few cases or no cases despite reports coming out that the both have.
  • mikemike
    It has always seem strange to me that china had thousands of confirmed cases of covid - 19 then suddenly it had gone down to just hundreds.
    I know china had a very strict lockdown but to drop that suddenly in a population of 1.4 billion. :hmm:
  • OutcastLondonerOutcastLondoner
    China also had makeshift hospitals and actual quarantines. Here we're still locked in with our families if we get it, so the spread can be slowed but we're likely to spread it to others. China had places to isolate the sick from others.

    But it seems there is genuine doubt about whether those numbers are real. They've also taken a very aggressive stance from a policy angle, pushing aid to other countries to give an image as the saviour rather than source. There's also this stuff about it now being treated in China as a "foreign disease" that is being brought into the country by outsiders. That's all a bit suspicious to me.
  • SlackerSlacker
    On a lighter note.Y’know all the experts and politicos always put themselves in front of bookshelves when they’re Skyping on telly?
    Well just saw our ‘arry on the news ........................ no books.Proof if ever it was needed! ;)
  • OutcastLondonerOutcastLondoner
    edited April 2020
    They say the really smart people are the ones who never put books behind them :wink:
  • whupathmanwhupathman
    one problem Italy has now is that the culture of cash in hand /pay no tax reportedly from the south has left many with no money and starving, the same with folk who own companies and pay dividends instead of wages to lower the tax,if anything may come of this then maybe the idea of paying tax as a safety net may help everyone.
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged
    OutcastLondoner said:

    They say the really smart people are the ones who never put books behind them :wink:

    What about people who put helicopters behind them?
  • jay_in_cptjay_in_cpt
    What about these absolute waste of space people who wanna cough etc on police officers...How pathetic are they......Words on here are not allowed to describe them...
  • BubblesNeverDiesBubblesNeverDies
    Add these to the list of lowlife scum.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52136560
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged

  • grey_til_I_dyegrey_til_I_dye
    spare some contumely for those who propagate false information re Covid.: https://www.theguardian.com/media/2020/apr/02/uk-media-outlets-told-not-to-promote-baseless-5g-coronavirus-theories

    contumely

  • IronHerbIronHerb
    Who said Huawei are unsafe to use in mobile networks? :biggrin:
  • IronHerbIronHerb
    Here's a rarity for you .

    A Covid19 test kit-

  • BubblesNeverDiesBubblesNeverDies
    A moving piece here:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52152375
  • EXETERHAMMEREXETERHAMMER
    edited April 2020
    IronHerb said:

    Here's a rarity for you .

    A Covid19 test kit-

    Also love the Wagamama cook book😊
  • IronHerbIronHerb
    Not me, that's my daughters. :whome:
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged
    Has anyone else noticed the flour shortage?

    The theory is that thanks to "Bake Off" people have decided to try baking at home while they have time on their hands so the shelves are now virtually empty. There's plenty of flour out there for industrial baking but the suppliers don't have enough "retail" packaging for shops and supermarkets.
  • OutcastLondonerOutcastLondoner
    Flour was one of the first things I noticed gone, about three weeks ago. Long before bread and a lot of the fresh stuff.
  • ASLEFshruggedASLEFshrugged
    My local Tescos is okay for fresh fruit, fresh veg and packaged bread etc. but no "in-store bakery" stuff.

    I didn't notice the flour until this week because I don't use a great deal and I didn't run out until Monday.
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