Covid19: Support and Chat

OutcastLondoner

mike said:

I have spoke to some people(on the phone)who do still not realise how this virus works?They will say it's okay to come round as "we are all fine" without realising that the incubation period could be up to fourteen days.

Try sharing this video with anyone who doesn't get it. I don't think the government's messaging has helped at all. It's a simple goal we should be working towards, in my view: keep hospital beds free.



A lot of people think it's about whether they get ill. Or they think they don't live with the elderly so it's fine. Not that they might not have symptoms and it can spread without being detected until it gets to people who fall very ill.

This is also worth sharing with people and can be a decent resource to cross-check yourself when someone forwards you some nonsense.

https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/myth-busters

BubblesNeverDies

Outcast, that is an excellent informative presentation, thanks for posting it. :ok:

I also found this:
In March 2019, 4 virus experts published what seems remarkably prescient warning - that bat-borne coronaviruses “will re-emerge to cause the next disease outbreak. In this regard, China is a likely hotspot”
They were all based at the Institute of Virology in Wuhan.

Here's a link to the report:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6466186/

thornburyiron

Outcast I think the government messaging has been really explicit and as far as I can tell from my experience so far the over 70’s, of whom I’m one, and the at risk, of whom I’m also one, are following the social distancing and where necessary, the self isolation, pretty well.
It’s the ones who seem to believe that as the illness would be reasonably mild for them that there’s no need to do anything. How many more times must the message be put across before it sinks in to their skulls.
My son says that the pubs where his girlfriend lives in Southfield are rammed every night and he’s seen groups of mums standing chatting outside the school gates.

thornburyiron

Bubbles practically every new corona virus emanates from China and unless they cease with their filthy habits of markets with dead and live animals being sold and kept together then it will continue to happen.

MrsGrey

thornburyiron said:

Bubbles practically every new corona virus emanates from China

Source for this claim?

Ace of Clubs

I’m over 70 and have COPD, the virus is not that much of a problem as I can stay at home to avoid it, my problem lies with the panic buying. I normally order my shopping online but find I’m unable to get what I need and it is now getting more difficult to book a delivery slot as more and more people are using the service. It seems to me that if these people continue in their selfish ways the government may have to resort to rationing.

MrsGrey

Thing is, many many people have been told to stay home, either because they are high risk or need to be isolated to avoid transmitting the virus

To comply, which is in the interests of society as a whole, a large number will have to order their shopping to be delivered. I don't see that as selfish, really. It's just an inevitable consequence of what is going on.

Some of it I also don't characterise as panic buying - if you have to stay home for 2 weeks, and securing a delivery slot is difficult, you are sensibly going to order as much as you need in a single transaction. Or if you are doing someone's shopping on their behalf in store ... same thing.

All the people now working at home (must be millions by now) - how many would get breakfast and lunch while they are going to/at work? And all those people using the bathroom facilities at work. Now they all need food and loo roll and hand soap and washing up liquid at home. Next, you've gt all the kids who had school dinners (millions) are going to need feeding lunch at home - the shopping has to be acquired somewhere! And it will be household by household, not like the companies and schools buy in bulk from other suppliers.

Ace of Clubs

Sorry Mrs Grey, I meant the panic buying not the delivery service.

MrsGrey

:ok:

My general point remains - this pandemic is causing massive behavioural shifts. Things aren't going to work like they did before.

MrsGrey

Oh, I've just seen this. Before coronavirus struck, nearly 8bn meals a year in the UK were being eaten out of home. Suddenly people are having to make nearly all their meals at home.

(In a Guardian report of a call from food policy experts about the need to introduce proper managed rationing rather than relying on ad hoc supermarket action and 'the market'._

thornburyiron

There was rationing during early childhood years because there were limited food supplies and we were allowed small amounts of staple foods each week.
There is no shortage of food at the current time and the shortfalls are brought about by people panic buying. One of our large Tesco stores was filling its shelves overnight but people were coming in at 2, 3,4 Am etc and filling trolleys. Some were doing this every night. Tesco no longer opens 24 hours but people still strip the shelves.
One of my neighbours who is below the at risk age was boasting the other day that they now have 12 packs of 48 toilet rolls.

Hamstew

thornburyiron said:

There was rationing during early childhood years because there were limited food supplies and we were allowed small amounts of staple foods each week.
There is no shortage of food at the current time and the shortfalls are brought about by people panic buying. One of our large Tesco stores was filling its shelves overnight but people were coming in at 2, 3,4 Am etc and filling trolleys. Some were doing this every night. Tesco no longer opens 24 hours but people still strip the shelves.
One of my neighbours who is below the at risk age was boasting the other day that they now have 12 packs of 48 toilet rolls.

I'm sure you agree anyway but you're neighbour is an idiot :ok:

SuzanneClaret

H1N1 / H1N5 and COVID-19 originated in China as a result of terrible/no animal husbandry.

Before airplane travel became the norm it didn’t matter so much that Chinese markets (for example) sold dead (cause of death unknown or cared about) animals for food. Now their practices have affected most of the planet.

There is an argument for quarantine (like they currently do with pets) for those who travel from areas where viruses of this nature originate.

We do TB checks at our boarders and I had to have a yellow fever vaccine to travel to a country whose name escapes me.

No reason why a similar system can’t be set up to prevent a similar spread of a contagion from happening again.

SuzanneClaret

Thorn

That person should be made to eat the toilet paper and nothing else for the rest of his isolation.

MrsGrey

SuzanneClaret said:

H1N1 / H1N5 and COVID-19 originated in China as a result of terrible/no animal husbandry.


There is an argument for quarantine (like they currently do with pets) for those who travel from areas where viruses of this nature originate.

We do TB checks at our boarders and I had to have a yellow fever vaccine to travel to a country whose name escapes me.

No reason why a similar system can’t be set up to prevent a similar spread of a contagion from happening again.

I thought at least one of those was from Mexico/USA? (But not sure.)

For your main point about quarantine, how do you quarantine for a new virus that nobody knows about? How do you test? How long do you quarantine for? For those reasons alone I think it isn't practicable.

It's one thing to vaccinate/require proof of vaccination for a known disease like yellow fever. But for completely new viruses.... :puzzled:

MrsGrey

Italy, though :nonono: :weep: :pray:

thornburyiron

Suzanne I had a similar thought but I was coming at it from the opposite end.

chicagohammer

The majority of people, even those under “shelter in place” ordinances are still able to leave their homes for grocery shopping, common sense tells you that maybe you should go once a week rather than three times a week and purchase accordingly but that still does not justify the hoarding and panic buying being witnessed.

This pandemic is not expected to interfere with the provision of life’s true staples such as electricity, water and food deliveries to grocery stores.

Unfortunately, over here, one of the most sort after items after loo rolls is guns

I wish common sense was just that - common

MrsGrey

chicagohammer said:

common sense tells you that maybe you should go once a week rather than three times a week and purchase accordingly

Wouldn't that make it more likely that you'll do a 'big shop' and clear the supermarket shelves more readily? If you spread your shopping out over 3 days, buying smaller amounts each time, you leave more for others...

That's kind of what I was getting at earlier, chicago - following the govt advice about reducing contact/interactions inevitably leads to 'bulk buying'. So (leaving aside the genuine idiots like thorn's neighbour) the empty shelves aren't necessarily evidence of 'panic buying' (ie people buying more than they need). Just a new way of shopping that reflects the new situation....

IronHerb

"Unfortunately, over here, one of the most sort after items after loo rolls is guns"

That's to stop anyone trying to steal your loo rolls. :run:

BubblesNeverDies

Panic buying, hoarding, stockpiling, whatever you want to call it, it's just a self-fulfilling event. In these uncertain times rational behaviour/thought, even for those who are capable of it, seems to go out the window. :wahoo:

OutcastLondoner

thornburyiron said:

Outcast I think the government messaging has been really explicit and as far as I can tell from my experience so far the over 70’s, of whom I’m one, and the at risk, of whom I’m also one, are following the social distancing and where necessary, the self isolation, pretty well.
It’s the ones who seem to believe that as the illness would be reasonably mild for them that there’s no need to do anything. How many more times must the message be put across before it sinks in to their skulls.
My son says that the pubs where his girlfriend lives in Southfield are rammed every night and he’s seen groups of mums standing chatting outside the school gates.

Thorn, I think there is some truth that people have been selfish and disinterested. But I also think this has been a long week and we've come a really long way in terms of what the government was saying. They were essentially only saying over 70s and people with certain health conditions should stay at home. Day by day, they've recommended something more and imposed more closures. I don't think that's a clear message.

In my opinion, the message about mild illnesses for the younger was confusing. There was an idea that it was only dangerous if you took it home to your vulnerable family members. I don't think it was made clear enough that you can be asymptomatic and spread it across the whole population. I don't think it was made clear enough that the goal is to keep hospital beds clear so that people aren't dying waiting for treatment of this or something else.

Regarding panic buying, I think it is happening Mrs Grey, though I think a lot of people have woken up to it. I've seen people throwing tons of things into trolleys (the weirdest to me is bottled water, as if tap water isn't fine). Obviously there is a balance. I've had to try and pick up a few extra of everything I'd usually buy because I'm staying with my parents who both have diabetes (and so do I) so we shouldn't be going out much and the delivery services are so delayed right now.

Moojor

I popped out today to get a few bits and pieces from the local co-op, they had signed up about limits of 2 essentials per customer. Which I thought was fair enough.

I attempted to buy 3 mini toberlone, as there are 3 people in our household and there was almost an entire shelf left of just of the things.

Was told, in no uncertain terms that it was 2 per customer on essential items....it's bad when toberlone is an essential item.

IronHerb

Surely it's bad when people moan about not being allowed to but three toblerone.

Moojor

IronHerb said:

Surely it's bad when people moan about not being allowed to but three toblerone.

I had literally gone out to buy the toberlone! :P
Plus I didn't moan, just thought it was funny, was going to point out that the lady in front of me had bought a bunch on 3 bananas....

ASLEFshrugged

chicagohammer said:

I wish common sense was just that - common

There's an excellent book called "Everything is obvious: once you know the answer" by Duncan J Watts - subtitled "Why common sense is nonsense".

I do little bits of shopping all through the week because I don't drive so everything I buy I have to carry home in a bag for life (or two).

Also it turns out I'm a "key worker". Coolio!

IronHerb

I managed to get a Sainsburys delivery slot for this weekend so I did our weekly shop, we usually shop in store, with minimal extras. My wife then added a shop for her eighty eight year old parents who live local and a bit of veg for my daughter.

It now looks like I'm panic shopping. :nonono:

BubblesNeverDies

Aslef, thanks for that.
Any excuse to play one of the 3 greatest rap songs ever

Coolio

ASLEFshrugged

Old Mother shrugged is 90, housebound and usually gets a weekly Tescos delivery, she phones her shopping list to my sister-in-law who places the order online. This week sister-in-law couldn't get a delivery slot so she went to her local Tesco, did the shopping and delivered it herself.

IronHerb

From Twitter -

lydia@lydiakahill

me and me dad are sharing the dining room table working from home today. He's an aerospace engineer on a conference call ordering fuselage prototypes and I'm drawing a duck

:biggrin:

PS She is a children book illustrator.