Burnley (H) 2.00pm Sunday 10th March

epsom_bubbles

Can we keep three up front on Thursday ??

Hammerdublin

Deliberate handball. Not given.

Pengeman

Two points lost. Should have had a penalty at the end. Philips is a liability and should not play again.

alderz

Phillips has been an absolutely dreadful signing so far

MunichHammer

Pengeman said:

Two points lost. Should have had a penalty at the end. Philips is a liability and should not play again.

This is the second game in a row that a clear pen isn't given. And let's not forget the Sheffield match where we should have had a penalty in the end and theirs should never have been given!

MrsGrey

Moyes should go back to the policy of not starting them straight after signing 😕

Lukerz

There is a reason Pep never gave him a game. Leeds seems about his level.

buffybegood

We were so poor in the first half and, although the players were poor, most of it was how we were set up imo. In the second half there was urgency in our play, something completely lacking in the first half. To me, this is mostly down to Moyes; we shouldn't start so negatively against such poor sides.

alderz

But when you hear Moyes talk after games like this he will always talk about his frustration at slow starts and how they didn’t execute the plan. I really don’t think it’s a deliberate ploy to be negative

buffybegood

alderz said:

But when you hear Moyes talk after games like this he will always talk about his frustration at slow starts and how they didn’t execute the plan. I really don’t think it’s a deliberate ploy to be negative

All very well for Moyes to say that, it's happened in so many games, and it's our default setting to play a low block with minimal possession, that it's on him imo, regardless of what he says.

buffybegood

Phillips we know just isn't up to speed for playing in the PL, but I thought JWP had a shocker today.

ScotHammer

Oh, the joys of being a West Ham fan. To misquote Forrest Gump, “West Ham are like a box of chocolates…….”. Can’t work out if the positive finish will give us a boost for Thursday, or if we’ll realise we almost lost to a team that couldn’t buy a result before today.

MIAHammer

Apparantly Burnley have never lost a PL game when winning at half time.

MIAHammer

Can we send KP back and stop paying his wages? That way Moyes won’t feel obliged to pick him.

buffybegood

buffybegood said:

Areola, Coufal, Mavropanos, Aguerd, Cresswell, Phillips, Souček ©, Ward-Prowse, Paquetá, Kudus, Bowen
Subs: Fabiański (GK), Johnson, Ogbonna, Zouma, Álvarez, Earthy, Ings, Antonio, Mubama

I'm relieved Zouma has dropped to the bench, but concerned that Emerson is out and we've got Cresswell in. I'm hoping Phillips will be getting up to speed now and will have a good game.

So much for my optimism.

Barney

Dont understand why we started off playing so negatively against the bottom side. I get soi frustrated with Moyes. We have the players to do much better by playing on the front foot. We constantly make negative passes even from free kicks

Lukerz

Aguerd is a weak CB, & we saw it again today with the goal. Yes, it’s a screamer, but he is weak in the challenge & it breaks for him to hit it.

Mavro is another error-prone defender. In many games, he’ll make poor decisions that end up leading to goals.

We are shipping way too many goals.

buffybegood

I've said it a few times recently, it's hard to believe we're so weak at CB seeing as it's a priority position for Moyes to sign someone every summer. I wouldn't be upset if any or all of them (Zouma - no knees, Ogbonna - too slow, Aguerd - too weak, especially in the air, Mavropanos - dreadful passing and error-prone) were let go in the summer.

claretandbluesky

I think my post from the Freiburg thread applies here also today.

It may end up doing us a favour as Moyes will have to set up to score rather than not concede and we are always at our best going forward. There have been so many times we have only come alive when going behind, so next weeks match we begin from that position which may help us.

thornburyiron

How are we setting up not to concede when we have Paqueta, Bowen and Kudus up front and Coufal and Emerson bombing forward a lot of the time.
If we were setting up not to concede then generally you’d expect us not to or at least not so many. It just seems that for some reason at the beginning of games and usually second halves we seem to have a “let’s see what they’ve got” mentality instead of “let’s show them what we’ve got”. Added to that our defenders seem to be completely error prone at the moment.

Pengeman

I don't think we have won any game in which Phillips has appeared or started so far. He is not match fit

I think Johnson has played in midfield this season and was more effective than Philips has been. May be he can be converted into a midfielder if his contract is renewed.

Bazshuayi

I'm assuming that the staff have an idea of his fitness levels? However, having not played in such a long time will not be helping. I hope he gets better obviously. I wonder if playing in the reserves for a bit might help

MIAHammer

I missed the first half so can't comment on that but at least Moyes made some early substitutions and didn't wait.
Ings did well in his cameo with a goal, a disallowed goal and hitting the crossbar. He certainly knows where the goal is but can't play the holding, lone man up front role.

MrsGrey

Bazshuayi said:

I'm assuming that the staff have an idea of his fitness levels? However, having not played in such a long time will not be helping. I hope he gets better obviously. I wonder if playing in the reserves for a bit might help

They see him in training, and do all the medical data stuff, so must know more than we do.

There is, of course, match 'sharpness' plus match 'experience' of playing with your team mates and building up understanding.

While playing in the reserves might help, the standard and speed is much lower than PL so not sure it will really help. If it would, wouldn't the coaching team have tried it? I'm thinking he's shown to be better than the U21s... also, won't help with developing an understanding of what team mates can/can't/will/want to do.

I saw someone earlier say there's a reason Pep didn't play him. But there's a reason Pep bought him...

claretandbluesky

thornburyiron said:

How are we setting up not to concede when we have Paqueta, Bowen and Kudus up front and Coufal and Emerson bombing forward a lot of the time.
If we were setting up not to concede then generally you’d expect us not to or at least not so many. It just seems that for some reason at the beginning of games and usually second halves we seem to have a “let’s see what they’ve got” mentality instead of “let’s show them what we’ve got”. Added to that our defenders seem to be completely error prone at the moment.

It's less the line up but rather the caution shown. When we need to score we look so much better and can cause problems for the best of teams but I think we so often play a more cautious game before we go behind. We were a different side in the second half today because we couldn't sit back and hope to catch a counter, we had to push forward and try and create a goal.

As for why we concede so many if trying not to I think that's two things, we are short of quality in the centre of defence at present and I also feel attack is the best form of defence and so letting teams come onto us allows them pressure, if we pushed them back more they would get to our last third less often.

I think most notice we have a gear to step up but rarely do until we are behind.

thornburyiron

My point is it’s our impression that he sets them up and tells them to let them come at us and we’ll try to hit them on the break as a counter attacking side. I don’t think I’ve ever really heard any of him, his staff or the team saying that and generally, including today, he wasn’t happy about the first half and stated that their intention was to start fast.
For some bizarre reason it seems the mentality of the side, particularly the midfield, that their initial priority is to help the defence rather than feed the forwards. Soucek is normally attack minded and most of us believed JWP always was.
We seem to my mind to have more attack focused players than defensive but they seem reluctant to do it which may explain why they’re not particularly good at the defensive part.

alderz

I still like Aguerd, and I think if he played with a dominant aerial centre back he’d be successful

chicagohammer

I actually thought the injection of pace and purpose that Antonio brought made a huge difference to the mindset going into the 2nd half, he is starting to get back some of his mojo and as some else said earlier, Ings is a competent and effective striker but only when he is accompanied up top and playing in a side on its front foot.

All in all I will take the point but more importantly will take that second half performance, we showed purpose, passion and my faith was partially restored.

COYI

buffybegood

chicagohammer said:

All in all I will take the point but more importantly will take that second half performance, we showed purpose, passion and my faith was partially restored.

The problem is that we know we have these performances in us, but, for some reason, we see them far too rarely and I feel that Moyes is a large part of the reason for this hence why I'd like to see someone else at the helm next season.

buffybegood

Although mentioned in commentary, no discussion of our penalty claim at the end by the MOTD pundits.