West Ham vs Arsenal (A) Match Thread 22.04.2018

thornburyiron

It was cruel but self inflicted. With City next week we could be right in the mire again. A point today would have been priceless.

baracks_a_hammer

We’ve been pasted on a fair few occasions under Moyes now. If he is the answer, I’d love to know what the question is...

madridhammer

Something has to change. 63 goals conceded this season & that isn't good enough whether we stay up or not. I think we'll be ok because I still think the others are worse but it doesn't bode well for the future.

horshamhammer

7 defeats of three goals or more since Moyes took over. In 27 matches.

thornburyiron

I know it shouldn't but I think the Rice mess really stuffed them. They'd worked their socks off for 80 minutes and to do something as stupid as that made their heads dropped. Conversely Arsenal knew that from what they thought was a draw they'd been gifted a win. Totally changed the demeanour of both sides.
Let's hope Rice learns that safety first is sometimes the best policy

whupathman

Another spineless collapse , boring now

Pengeman

I think we lacked energy after Fernandez and Mario went-off. For Arsenal's last goal, Caroll was chasing and was in the penalty area with Kouyate and Lanzini nowhere to be seen. In the last 10 mnutes there wasn't much cover the defence from midfielders.

jay_in_cpt

Rice will learn...
The way it ended was sad, especially after we got back in it.
Hands up to Hart, under pressure can't knock his performance.
Typical Hammers , get back in to it and fold easily after the 2nd goal..

Before Wenger announcement thought it was a good time to play them , after it, def not, & so it proved....
But we did buckle a little too easy.
Tough few weeks ahead , just gotta hope Stoke & Southampton continue their winless run.

Lukerz

It’s all gonna depend on if Saints beat Bournemouth next weekend. Given our game we could head to Leicester 3 points ahead with an inferior GD. Nervy times.

Lukerz

Can’t play well in cameos. To let in four so easily against that side in 8 mins is just not good enough at any level of football.

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

Still got United, City and Liverpool to play right

Gonna be a tense couple weeks

Shocking we didnt beat Stoke

MarkNobleLocalHero

Liverpool????? Do you mean Everton?

WHU_Champo_league_in_7_years

Yep thats the one

thornburyiron

City and United are the top 4 sides we have to play plus Leicester and Everton. It could be that 36 points will be enough depending on what those below us do.
I definitely believe that but for the Rice error we'd have seen the game out as Arsenal would have got frustrated. They always overdo things but once they were in the lead again they knew it was unlikely we'd score again.
In the last five minutes we looked as if we were waiting for the final whistle and gave them far too much room. Even then if Cresswell hadn't got a touch for the fourth goal Hart would have saved it.

grey_til_I_dye

I'm not really sure what people want.

There were demands for us to use more attacking players, and when we put them on, we got a goal and shipped three.

That was always going to be the risk against Arsenal at home.

Arsenal have thumped pretty much every team of our standard at home this season.

With less cover through MF, we were always going to be vulnerable.

OutcastLondoner

The only time we had any energy or looked like scoring, and did, was after Lanzini and Hernandez came on. We were better than them for a little while. The Rice mistake was out of nowhere, then it opened up, not before.

I think it was unlucky and he'll probably learn but it does seem to have shaken the team.

Brother_Sledge

As a fully paid up member of 'the Rice can do no wrong and what is Joe Hart doing at the club' club - I am inclined to think Rice must have had a shout of some sort from Hart

thornburyiron

As Moyes said, regardless of whether there was a shout or not the job of the centre half is to clear the ball and argue about it afterwards. You don't duck under the ball when barely six yards out.

SuzanneClaret

Left feeling very frustrated again by Moyes team selection and substitutions.

OutcastLondoner

Brother_Sledge said:

As a fully paid up member of 'the Rice can do no wrong and what is Joe Hart doing at the club' club - I am inclined to think Rice must have had a shout of some sort from Hart

Paired with the Masuaku leave, I was wondering whether Hart's made some kind of sound that they've thought was a call. Probably not, it's just weird they both moved, and both still should've dealt with it.

imagelost

I blame Moyes for this , sitting back and invite the the traffic on,,, like a a lot people said would happen on this site

OldCastleSwift

Suze ;ok

For me this game was a free hit. We'd have probably lost regardless of which XI we put out, so I was hoping we may have been a braver with the selection.

I think Hernandez has been terribly underutilised this season and wouldn't be at all surprised if he went in the summer.

At which point we'll be looking for an affordable, experienced and proven Premier League goal scorer.

Like Javier Hernandez.

thornburyiron

Can't see apart from the final few minutes that we sat back and invited them on. We had all the attacking players people wanted on the pitch and looked as if a draw was likely. Come the Rice mess and it all went to pieces.
Regardless of initial team selection and substitutions we were holding one of this season's top form home sides to a draw and conceded three when our attackers were on.

SuzanneClaret

OCS ;ok

I don’t think he needed to be brave, he just needed not to be so timid. For two games on the trot he’s given Mario and Fernandez far too long on the pitch. Only making changes when it was too late.

Very uninspired.

grey_til_I_dye

imagelost said:

I blame Moyes for this , sitting back and invite the the traffic on,,, like a a lot people said would happen on this site

Sorry, Image, but that isn't where the goals came from, and it isn't what we did.

I think people calling for Moyes to have been 'braver' from the start, in terms of attacking play, should at least reflect on the likelihood of us getting thumped if we had.

We were far more vulnerable once we had Lanzini and Chicarito on the pitch.

For me, Moyes did the right thing: set up to be hard to get past, and look to counter-attack, which we did successfully during the first half.

Once we went behind he took the risk of being more attacking, with the almost inevitable result.

OldCastleSwift

Then the biggest challenge Moyes faces next season is getting the balance right.

It seems like we can either be defensive, and lose by a goal or two, or be more attacking and lose by three or four.

Biggest frustration for me is that we suffer when we go with a more attacking line up because our midfield is so poor in terms of quality and numbers; something we've fundamentally failed to address during the last two windows.

Lukerz

If we had a decent midfield and a dynamic RB, we’d be better suited to opening up the game. As it is we have a grandad pro at full back and two slow midfielders trying to cover the entire pitch, two players who have been our midfield pairing since 2014.

baracks_a_hammer

Whilst we don’t know everything that goes on behind closed doors, my gut instinct tells me there’s a problem between Moyes and Little Pea. Credit to the latter who has managed to keep his emotions in check - if Moyes is kept on, Hernandez will be looking for an immediate way out and I for one would not blame him.

OldCastleSwift

Lukerz said:

If we had a decent midfield and a dynamic RB, we’d be better suited to opening up the game. As it is we have a grandad pro at full back and two slow midfielders trying to cover the entire pitch, two players who have been our midfield pairing since 2014.

Lukerz ;ok

With decent investment (and assuming we stay up) we could start next season with something like:

Heaton
Rice Reid Ogbonna
Fredericks Dendoncker Cairney Masuaku
Antonio Arnautovic
Hernandez

Nothing outrageously ambitious in that line up, IMO, but it would still cost upwards of £50m to get the four new players in. Just can't see it happening.

And to get back on topic, todays game has proven once again that our midfield needs a big overhaul in the summer.

SuzanneClaret

Or when a players is underperforming in a game he is subbed even if we haven’t reached 70 minutes.