Tamper-gate (Those naughty Aussie cricketers...)

Cuz1

Smith warner Bancroft sent home coach to continue, can’t believe he didn’t know anything but least it’s a start now ban them for a year minimum

baracks_a_hammer

12 month bans for Smith and Warner apparently - reckon that’s the end of warner’s international career

Cuz1

Hope so comes across as a vile man

alderz

I'm seeing a lot on twitter about how this is a real escalation in terms of punishment (Du Plessis got a 100% match fee fine in 2016, and a 50% fine in 2013). But I think that the issue here is more than the act of tampering itself. It's the admission of a group of senior players conspiring to cheat, and then making a junior player take the fall for it. The whole thing is incredibly unsavoury.

IronHerb

But it wasn't a 'group' of senior players. Warner and Bancroft concocted and carried out the ball tampering. Smith was aware and did nothing about it.
Apparently the bowlers didn't notice the ball had been tampered with. ;lol

baracks_a_hammer

Alderz

But if you take the field with a lolly (du Plessis) or a certain type of mint (trescothick in 2005), then there must be some sort of pre-meditated intention?? ;hmm

PrestonHammer

There have been no proven tests that using saliva, after a sweet has been in a persons mouth, makes the ball shinier. If anything it would make the ball sticky, which would be useless if you want to put some shine on the ball.

baracks_a_hammer

It doesn’t matter if the intention is there. Trescothick I beleive even admitted they had researched it.

Cannot see any reason why a cricketer would need to take a boiled sweet onto the field of play other than for questionable intentions - but that’s just my opinion

IronHerb

You can't break a law that isn't a law. Saliva and sweat are not considered an 'outside influence' (I think that's the term used).

PrestonHammer

They have always had sweets on the field of play. I think at one time the umpires used to give the players sweets, if they'd been good, Peter Willey, I think.

Trescothick said in his book that he had tried a number of sweets and found that Murray mints worked the best. I see that as the same thing as Dave Brailsford telling the other teams at the London Olympics, that the British teams wheels were rounder than everyone elses, which caused the French to make a complaint about said wheels, even though they were manufactured in France.

alderz

IronHerb said:

But it wasn't a 'group' of senior players. Warner and Bancroft concocted and carried out the ball tampering. Smith was aware and did nothing about it.

I mean, I think it's pretty straightforward to suggest that three players involved is a group. And by Steve Smith's own admission the "leadership group" knew about it. So it's that group aspect that makes it worse, imo.

baracks_a_hammer said:

But if you take the field with a lolly (du Plessis) or a certain type of mint (trescothick in 2005), then there must be some sort of pre-meditated intention?? ;hmm

I don't disagree that there is premeditation there. But it is also about an individual.

To me, this whole episode suggests there is a culture of behaviour among that team. Otherwise the conversation would never have come up. And when I say that, I am in no way suggesting that such a culture doesn't exist in any or all of the other teams at that level, but as Australia are the one that has been caught out, they are the ones who we can speak about with a degree certainty.

Vorselaarhammer

Nit surprised....

--
BBC Sport
‏
Verified account

@BBCSport
15m15 minutes ago
More
Darren Lehmann is to quit his role as head coach of Australia at the end of the current Test match against South Africa.

Cuz1

Probably before they find out he knew about ball tampering,in the ashes one of the worlds best swing bowlers couldn’t reverse swing but there three Quick’s could mmmm let’s look at the evidence

baracks_a_hammer

All four bowlers incl a spinner shared a the ashes wickets, and the likes of smith scored bucket loads of runs. Whatever one may think may or may not have happened with regards to ball tampering, 4-0 was still going to be the outcome IMO in the ashes

baracks_a_hammer

Something which hasn’t been mentioned on this thread

Last year Steve smith was caught trying to a abuse the drs system in India by trying to seek assistance from the dressing room. Ie cheating

So he does have previous...

Chappers

As a huge fan of cricket and a cricketer myself, this is all very sad. To see Smith & Bancroft sat in front of the media with their professional lives in tatters doesn't make for comfortable viewing.
Warner is said to be a nasty bit of work and a bully on the field and has pushed his luck once too often and has come unstuck at last. He encouraged, using his senior influence, a young player (Bancroft) into going through with this act.
He IMO is the worst culprit here and deserves what he gets.

However, they have way over stepped the mark in their conduct.
Questions should be asked of the Ashes series too. There is a lot of pride for our nations at stake in that.
We have a swing bowler who is the best in the world at his craft and for the entire series couldn't get the ball to move an inch - their bowlers (not the best swing bowlers but decent enough) were getting it to hoop round corners at times... How?!

I think we still would've lost by a big margin in that series but loosing isn't the issue.
Winning is important but how you win is more important if you ask me.

baracks_a_hammer

So by inference are we now accusing Boult and Southee and the Kiwis?

Because England have just been castled by swing which Anderson didn’t manage to replicate?

Anderson has always had a much better record at home. And also don’t they use a different ball down under?

So many factors.

Cuz1

Not sure think they use a kookabora in aus not sure about New Zealand though but see cricket Australia may be looking into it and now the coach as resigned as well

Vorselaarhammer

Is tampering with the ball the only way to cheat effectively in Cricket? I am not super knowledgeable so curious.

In football we have diving / violent conduct / play acting and you can normally see 2 our of the 3 in most games.

The huge reaction to this ball tampering (the Aussie PM had a dedicated press conference, it was the 3 story on BBC news last night) it surprising for me.

Ace of Clubs

IronHerb

It's was a pink ball used in NZ, as it was a day/night match, and they tend to swing a lot.

Lehmann has, so far, got away with murder. The players thought they were invincible under his leadership and so they carried out a reckless act.

Cuz1

I think imo Warner will quit and spill the beans

ClaretandBlueforLife

I think it’s all pretty much out in the open and although I think the punishment should have been much harsher it’s good that it has been dealt with quickly and Australian Cricket can move on.

buffybegood

Warner completely refusing to answer whether it was just he, Smith and Bancroft that were involved or knew about what was going on.

Very, very clear that others at the very least knew about it.

Cuz1

I think imo Warner will quit and spill the beans as soon as he realises he won’t be picked by the Aussies again

ClaretandBlueforLife

Cuz,
Possibly he will, if it turns out that others at least knew about it, then I think Australian Cricket has a massive problem on its hands which will take a very long time to overcome, if as it would suggest a culture of cheeting is widespread in the squad.

Is it just me or do others think that with so many incidents like this and the taking of banned substances/drugs in cycling & Athletics have devalued their respective sports, if that’s the right word? To be honest after Russian state’s involvement and the subsequent banning I look at results in Athletics event and question what banned substance has this or that athletic taken when they’ve won?

alderz

I was talking to my dad yesterday and he said that apparently this incident was spotted as an Afrikaans commentator asked the cameramen to follow the ball around when Australia were fielding as they get the ball the reverse swing about 15 overs before anyone else.

He also mentioned that Warner had been ‘shining’ the ball with a heavily bandaged hand, and the South African’s questioned if that was ok in the prior test.

So, it seems like it is something they have even doing for a while, and when Warner was questioned they had to change the plan and get Bancroft to do it.

thornburyiron

Alderz it was an ex South African test player who was commentating who asked the cameraman to follow the ball. I can't remember the player's name

alderz

thorn

Yeah he said that he’s the Afrikaans commentator on a South African channel, but I too have forgotten the name

IronHerb

Doesn't stop him being Afrikaans.